Port Vale v 2013 FA Cup Winners

[Look Out There Are Llamas]

The problem in itself is not the concept of parachute payments. It's the disparity in income between Premier League sides and everyone below. The gulf in revenue is ridiculous and a disgrace but no one in charge of English football has the guts to challenge this monopoly. The Premier League sides take far too much of the Sky TV money and don't give anywhere near enough to lower league sides.

What is it for this season, 70m basic for every Premier League side, 10m basic for every Championship side. Say for example the outgoings of a team getting relegated is 60m and they make a profit of 10m, they're spending within their means and cutting the cloth accordingly as is the expression used by a few on here. Without any form of parachute payment how in the space of about 8 weeks can a team be expected to cut their expenditure down from 60m to 10m? It's just not feasible, without parachute payment, pretty much every side to get relegated would go straight into Administration. If a Premier League side was getting 50m basic and a Championship side 30m basic etc then there would be no need whatsoever for parachute payments.

Also it takes time for a club to realistically be able to trim their expenditure to lower league levels minus parachute payments, that's why it's spread over 4 years. Peoples livelihoods are at risk when budgets are trimmed and it's the smaller none playing staff that suffer the most.

Wigan made a profit in the last 3 Premier League seasons in a row and regularly sold young players on for big profit to be a self sustainable model. We have made a profit in the last 2 seasons despite being in the Championship. We're on course to make a profit again this season in League One, we're a very well run club. We sold about 8m worth of players this Summer and reinvested 4m of that. We have halved the wage bill this Summer as we ensure we are spending within financial fair play and being self sustaining. We've signed a lot of talented youngsters capabale of playing at a higher level, which we can sell on for big fees, once parachute payments run out.

But we've been like that prior to our Premier League days, we sold Roy Carroll to Manchester United for 2.5m in 2001 and that was reinvested in the signings of Lee McCulloch, Nathan Ellington and Jason Roberts. We had one of the smallest wage budgets in the Championship the season we went up, we built our success on youth players like Leighton Baines, bargains like Bullard for 200k and a number of shrewd free transfers. Yet you have clubs like Blackburn, Derby, Middlesbrough, QPR, Fulham etc spending 5/6m+ on players, some 10m+ and spending well over their means. Yet we're always perceived as the main protagonists.

Excellent first post.

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

Not long ago that was your home support, not away.
Will be again soon I reckon.

well guess it will always be above yours home and away

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

well guess it will always be above yours home and away

Oh, what a short memory you have!
Remind me again, how many did you take to Wembley against us in the play off final?
Less than 10,000 out of a crowd of £54,000?

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

Oh, what a short memory you have!
Remind me again, how many did you take to Wembley against us in the play off final?
Less than 10,000 out of a crowd of £54,000?

was waiting for that haha and my god you got lucky that game battered you start to finish and were are these 40k fans now ? your just like millwall a load of band wagoners come when you get to wembley not real fans it would be the same again if you got to play off final..people just going for a day out

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

A Wigan fan talking about 'real fans'!!
I haven't laughed so much since granddad undone the wrong chandelier

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

A Wigan fan talking about 'real fans'!!
I haven't laughed so much since granddad undone the wrong chandelier

keep laughing and make sure you keep that top spot warm for us because you wont be there long,would love to see your attendances if you made a bad start barely 4k home fans,pitiful club compared to us its not even worth talking about

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

keep laughing and make sure you keep that top spot warm for us because you wont be there long,would love to see your attendances if you made a bad start barely 4k home fans,pitiful club compared to us its not even worth talking about

I'm not sure if you are on a wind up or you really are as thick as a whale omelette.
Anyway, just to re-iterate, I wasn't joking when I said your average crowds were 2,500.
Look it up. Before 1999 when Whelan's money started coming in to play, you really did average between 2,500 - 3,000.
You have always been a tinpot little club in an egg chasing town.
You bought your way to the land of greed and now you will tumble back down to where you belong.

Anyway, back on topic:

Come on Vale!

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

I'm not sure if you are on a wind up or you really are as thick as a whale omelette.
Anyway, just to re-iterate, I wasn't joking when I said your average crowds were 2,500.
Look it up. Before 1999 when Whelan's money started coming in to play, you really did average between 2,500 - 3,000.
You have always been a tinpot little club in an egg chasing town.
You bought your way to the land of greed and now you will tumble back down to where you belong.

Anyway, back on topic:

Come on Vale!

you need money in football to do well ? right or wrong ? show me a club who hasn't spent money to do well. you do realize your a much smaller club than us you bitter cu nt and of course you will get more fans in higher leagues.you wouldn't know that!

 

[leedsvaliant]

you need money in football to do well ? right or wrong ? show me a club who hasn't spent money to do well. you do realize your a much smaller club than us you bitter cu nt and of course you will get more fans in higher leagues.you wouldn't know that!

A smaller club? I'd say Gillingham, along with most clubs in this league are historically bigger than Wigan. You were getting between 2 and 3 K avergae before Dave Whelan and I suspect that if you drop down into league 2 you would be looking at that again. Your attendance has (understandably) risen during your last few glory years but you could never consider yourself a 'big' club. You were a non-league outfit for many years.

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

You have to admit though, he is kind of entertaining.
Even if it would take two of him to make a halfwit.

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

You have to admit though, he is kind of entertaining.
Even if it would take two of him to make a halfwit.

look at the history you complete idiot hahahaha we get more fans and have won more than you surely your on a wind up here hahahaha we are not a big club but much bigger than port vale and gillingham..be realistic!

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

A smaller club? I'd say Gillingham, along with most clubs in this league are historically bigger than Wigan. You were getting between 2 and 3 K avergae before Dave Whelan and I suspect that if you drop down into league 2 you would be looking at that again. Your attendance has (understandably) risen during your last few glory years but you could never consider yourself a 'big' club. You were a non-league outfit for many years.

ifs and buts the fact is we are bigger than you and gillingham you have nothing on wigan at all...

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

I am not even arguing.We all know who is right here.So because we were non league team for while in the past we can never be a bigger club hahahahahhaha damn i wish we would of got in the old div 3 a lot sooner hahahahahha

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

averaged 7k in 1978 as well hahahahahha god i love the bitterness keep it coming it makes my day 17 years as a league club and we have done more than port vale and gillingham combined hahahahahahaha this is to funny

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

averaged 7k in 1978 as well hahahahahha god i love the bitterness keep it coming it makes my day 17 years as a league club and we have done more than port vale and gillingham combined hahahahahahaha this is to funny

You were elected into the football league in 1978 fuckwit.
Maths not your strong point or do you really know fuck all about your club?

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

You were elected into the football league in 1978 fuckwit.
Maths not your strong point or do you really know fuck all about your club?

no football facts are my strong point pal you said we didn't have any fans until whelan came :\ just accept we are bigger than you.you can move on with your life. have good night

 

[valefan16]

averaged 7k in 1978 as well hahahahahha god i love the bitterness keep it coming it makes my day 17 years as a league club and we have done more than port vale and gillingham combined hahahahahahaha this is to funny

We averaged 25000 in the 50s what's your point?

You've won an FA Cup granted but I'd imagine your average historical league position isn't any better and you've actually played 2000 football league games less than Gillingham and 3000 less than Vale...

A Wigan fan that's maybe lost track of his clubs history through the decade of success maybe.

 

[Bartonyellow]

Wigan are a bigger club.

End of chat.
When you have won an f a cup and been In the prem averaging 20k then you can come back with something constructive.

 

[leedsvaliant]

Wigan are a bigger club.

End of chat.
When you have won an f a cup and been In the prem averaging 20k then you can come back with something constructive.

You failed to add that this is during the past ten years. Any club with their recent success would have been averaging 20 k. History however tells us that they've never had decent attendances before that and I suspect they'll go that way again. There are several clubs in this league far bigger than Wigan.

 

[Will]

Wigan are a bigger club.

End of chat.
When you have won an f a cup and been In the prem averaging 20k then you can come back with something constructive.

Absolute horsemuck. They were propelled there by Whelan's riches. Since then they've began falling back to their level. Rushden and Diamonds spent time in the football league, does that make them as big a club as say Bristol Rovers? Nope. Bournemouth as big as Sheffield Wednesday? Nope.

Clubs have peaks and troughs. Average them out over their existence and you get something like the size of the club.

 

[Bartonyellow]

Absolute horsemuck. They were propelled there by Whelan's riches. Since then they've began falling back to their level. Rushden and Diamonds spent time in the football league, does that make them as big a club as say Bristol Rovers? Nope. Bournemouth as big as Sheffield Wednesday? Nope.

Clubs have peaks and troughs. Average them out over their existence and you get something like the size of the club.

I understand these parallels but the comparison was with your own club. In my opinion, for what it is worth I think Wigan are bigger.
I guess it depends on your definition of the word bigger. Is it what you have won? Is it over your history complete like you state?
Is it fan base? Stadium?
All are subjective. But they have made modern history and won the cup plus been in the prem - that for me outweighs their non league days.
Not that it matters as we are all in the same pot pissing in it.

 

[Bartonyellow]

Here is another example. Our recent history for me makes us bigger than say Grimsby or Lincoln who have drifted into non league obscurity. Irrespective of fan base and what they may have won in 1892 etc. modern history counts for a lot. Same as Chelsea. People say they are not a big club as they don't have the history but they are making it now by winning titles and champions league.

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

I understand these parallels but the comparison was with your own club. In my opinion, for what it is worth I think Wigan are bigger.
I guess it depends on your definition of the word bigger. Is it what you have won? Is it over your history complete like you state?
Is it fan base? Stadium?
All are subjective. But they have made modern history and won the cup plus been in the prem - that for me outweighs their non league days.
Not that it matters as we are all in the same pot pissing in it.

So there is someone on this site who does not talk crap i can understand a leeds,forest sheff utd ect past successful clubs saying this but gillingham and port vale come on..have a day off.

 

[wiganmudhuts28]

Wigan have spent more years out of the top 4 divisions than they have in it. The only clubs who will have worse records are probably Fleetwood and Burton?

So that makes you a small club ? Were the youngest club and have achieved more than 80% of this league..its called lack of respect

 

[Will]

I understand these parallels but the comparison was with your own club. In my opinion, for what it is worth I think Wigan are bigger.
I guess it depends on your definition of the word bigger. Is it what you have won? Is it over your history complete like you state?
Is it fan base? Stadium?
All are subjective. But they have made modern history and won the cup plus been in the prem - that for me outweighs their non league days.
Not that it matters as we are all in the same pot pissing in it.

Over the last decade, yes they are the bigger club. But I would credit the last 10 years of wigan's history to Dave Whelan rather than the club itself. (Doesn't really make sense I know). Wigan without Whelan are lower league club.

We have never been bankrolled by a sugardaddy owner and so our league positions have reflected the size of our club. If the Whelan of 1995 were to buy any club in this division he could get them to the premier league.

 

[Vale on Trent]

Wigan are a bigger club than Gillingham in my opinion.

 

[darren gregory]

Wigan are bigger than us now, however historically are tiny, anyone recall April 1993 at Springfield park ? Wigan 0 Vale 4 Attendance 3743 of which at least 1500 were Vale supporters, thats my shout on this one.

 

[leedsvaliant]

Wigan are a bigger club than Gillingham in my opinion.

It's all a matter of opinions I guess. Bar the bankrolled last 10 years or so Wigan have historically been a poorly supported bottom division/non league team. They have only grown in size due to the premier league effect and without the money I suspect they'd be getting 2-4 k every week in the bottom divisions.

 

[THE LAST WALTZ]

I must admit when we comfortably beat Wigan 2-0 the other week it didn't feel like a 'giant killing'.

Now I know, I am proper fucking chuffed!

 

[Vale on Trent]

The argument 'bar the last ten years or so' though doesn't really stand does it? Wigan aren't as small a club now as people are making out on here. For a generation of many peoples' lives, Wigan have been a sustained Premier League club and won the FA Cup for god sake.