The General England Euro 2016 Thread

ColB

Active Member
Messages
304
Likes
37
Location
Staffordshire
Supports
Port Vale
Thread starter #1
I was just wondering what everyone's first 11 would be at this moment in time. There's a lot of doom and gloom around our national team, a lot of it fair, but I do think we have a lot of talent around although whether Roy Hodgson is the right man to get the best out of them is another thing. My 11 is one with a very young average age and one that could grow together with a bit of luck.

Hart

Clyne
Stones
Cahill
Shaw

Delph
Wilshere
Chamberlain

Sterling
Walcott

Sturridge/Kane

For me that's a side that has a lot of pace and could be devastating on the counter. We're never going to keep possession better than the very top teams on the world stage so I think a counter attacking game suits us down to the ground. I've been a fan of Wayne Rooney but do feel like he peaked a few years ago and think we now have better alternatives. I've never been completely convinced over Cahill but he's probably the best we have at this moment in time. Chris Smalling has improved lately and hopefully he can continue to do so. Both Chamberlain and Barkley are inconsistent but at this moment in time I'd go for Oxlade as he doesn't go missing as much as Ross has a tendency to do. Big season for Harry Kane to show that last season wasn't just a bit of a fluke. I think he's a very good player, but how he does this season will tell us more about him than all the goals he scored in the last campaign.
 

Modernist

Well-Known Member
Messages
602
Likes
266
Supports
Freedom
#4
Just looking at those 11 I'm surprised you think we have the talent. The talent to do what exactly? To qualify for tournaments? Sure, to win any of them?, not a chance.
 

ColB

Active Member
Messages
304
Likes
37
Location
Staffordshire
Supports
Port Vale
Thread starter #5
No Rooney? With his goalscoring record for England?

Front 4 surely Ox, Rooney and Sterling with Kane up top
As mentioned, I think he's past his best and would prefer to see others. That's not to say that he shouldn't be in the squad or feature for England again, not at all. On current form, and I'm also talking about his performances for United at the back end of last season, he wouldn't be in my 11. But my team is based around the fact of Sturridge coming back for Liverpool and actually staying fit, and also Kane scoring goals again , and neither is an absolute given.
 

ColB

Active Member
Messages
304
Likes
37
Location
Staffordshire
Supports
Port Vale
Thread starter #6
Just looking at those 11 I'm surprised you think we have the talent. The talent to do what exactly? To qualify for tournaments? Sure, to win any of them?, not a chance.
I don't see why we can't do well at the Euro's with that bit of luck you need. Greece won it some years ago with a much less talented side, simply because they were organized, together as a team and had the luck that you need. If used correctly we have a lot of pacey players that will give any side trouble on the counter. The likes of Stones, Shaw, Clyne, Wilshere, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Barkley, Walcott, Sterling, Sturridge and Kane etc are all talented players and all can still improve further.
 

Richard Cranium

Goma Lambu 12" penis
Messages
4,113
Likes
1,937
Supports
Mansfield
Twitter
@jallsop93
#7
No wonder we are miles behind any of the top countries.

When you think in the last 10/15 years we've had players like Gary Neville, Rio Ferdinand, John Terry, Ashley Cole, Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard who some were probably in the top 4/5 players in the world in the position they play. We never got past a 1/4 final with that lot so the likes of Luke Shaw and Sterling just getting to the knockout stage of either the Euro's or World Cup would be an achievement now!

Really hope the likes of Stones, Barkley and Kane step up to be real quality players after some encouraging signs in the last couple of seasons. I rate Jack Wilshere but he's never fit, Sounds like he's out of the next qualifiers aswell. Next Summer will be interesting but surely going to be Roy's last? Where do we go from there. I'd like us to take a risk but we'll probably appoint another FA yes man in Southgate.
 

Murphy

Bloody Nice Chap
Messages
2,139
Likes
1,189
Location
Norwich
Supports
Dagenham & Redbridge and Stephen Mulhern.
Twitter
@NickMurphy1995
#8
Not sure about the whole team but Oxlade-Chamberlain would be the first name on my teamsheet (barring Hart, obviously). Constant menace whenever he plays, frustrates me that he can't hold down a regular spot at Arsenal or I reckon he'd mature into an even better player.
 

ArmchairDiehard

Glory Supporter
Messages
1,133
Likes
261
Location
Evostik Prem
Supports
Darlington
#9
Not sure about the whole team but Oxlade-Chamberlain would be the first name on my teamsheet (barring Hart, obviously). Constant menace whenever he plays, frustrates me that he can't hold down a regular spot at Arsenal or I reckon he'd mature into an even better player.
See I'm still unconvinced by Chamberlain. He's shown plenty of promise but just doesn't do enough for me. If we're playing 4-2-3-1 I'd rather see Walcott and Sterling as the two wide players.
 

ColB

Active Member
Messages
304
Likes
37
Location
Staffordshire
Supports
Port Vale
Thread starter #10
See I'm still unconvinced by Chamberlain. He's shown plenty of promise but just doesn't do enough for me. If we're playing 4-2-3-1 I'd rather see Walcott and Sterling as the two wide players.
I think Ox is one of those sort of players that need to have a run of games, something he never seems to do at Arsenal for one reason or another. There doesn't seem to be too much middle ground with him, he's either pretty shocking or close to brilliant.
 

Leewilson

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
3,954
Likes
1,719
Supports
Dagenham and Redbridge
#13
The back 4
Hart picks himself in goal. Really we should be blooding Shaw for the year in the lead up the Euros. Clyne should ease into the right back slot. Stones is our best young centre back and like Shaw should be blooded alongside Cahill. Jones, Smalling and Jagielka are capable back up.

The 3 in the centre


This is the area we have to get right. So often our balance has been completely wrong here. Carrick at 34 has one more tournament in him and he really deserves to go into one as our first choice CM. He is an excellent user of the ball and positionally is excellent. I would also go for Milner over Henderson at present. Milner is coming into his prime now and has impressed me in Liverpool's midfield with his tireless energy and good use of the ball. His range of passing and vision is vastly underestimated. Plus he'll provide support going forward. Finally it's a toss up between Wilshere and Barkley for the final position. We need a bit of spark and magic in there. I'd be tempted to go for Wilshere if fit but higher up as I really think he has the attributes to play between the lines and play the intricate passes.

Out wide

We need width. We aren't good enough movers and users of the ball to go narrow. Even Arsenal struggle when they're too narrow. Sterling out on the left side is fine by me. He'll only get better at Man City. Either Ox or Walcott out on the other side. If he can get over his ego, I'd even be tempted to play Sturridge a little bit wider when fully fit supporting the man up top.

Striker

Harry Kane. Rooney's had it. Kane is used to being the lone man up front and has excelled at it. A bit of width won't hurt either as he's perfectly capable of scoring headed goals.

We need to lose the 'trying to play like Barcelona' fascination as well. We're not very good at it. We need to go back to speed and tempo. Sterling, Ox/Walcott, Milner, Wilshere. That is tireless and supported by the calm head in Carrick. It works.

-------------------Hart

Clyne---Stones---Cahill---Shaw

-----------------Carrick--------------

Ox/Wal---Milner---Wilshere--Sterling

------------------Kane-----------------------
 
Messages
1,891
Likes
1,947
Location
Bet365
Supports
Coral.co.uk & Ladbrokes.com
Twitter
@taylorswift13
#16
Those 7 goals coming against the mighty Slovenia, Lithuania, Scotland, Slovenia (again) and San Marino.. time to build for the future I think
He's 29. At what age should England be dumping players? It's not as if England are full of old players, it's generally a young team isn't it?

Not sure I understand the rationale of dumping one of your best internationals.
 

Ebeneezer Goode

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,646
Likes
1,539
Supports
England
#17
It's all the chances he misses though. He gets four or five great chances every game before he actually puts one away. Hard to believe Kane or even Berahino would be so wasteful.
 

Leewilson

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
3,954
Likes
1,719
Supports
Dagenham and Redbridge
#19
His record at major tournaments, bar 2004 when he broke through, is woeful. If Rooney goes on to have a great season with United and goes into the Euros in great form, then I take it back and he deserves an opportunity (even though he'll probably be shattered by the time the tournament begins and underperform again). But in reality, he'll have an average season with the odd burst and then Hodgson will take him to the Euros where he will have a shocker. I don't see him ever getting back to the player he once was.

Sometimes, we're a bit too nice as a country. It's not a great comparison but I look at our cricket one day side in recent times. There was a World Cup coming up and instead of realising that perservering with something that isn't working wasn't going to win us the tournament, we stuck with it and were embarassed. After the World Cup, we make wholesale changes and play some wonderful stuff. We could have done this 6 months before the tournament and given ourselves a fighting chance but people are sometimes too scared of change and only do it when we've driven something that isn't working into the ground and made any change completely unavoidable.

I'm not saying, get rid of all the senior players and start again because that's just not realistic. But there's no reason why we can't give something slightly different a go. Whilst Rooney's record on paper looks good, ultimately it doesn't match up in the big knockout football games. Why not try something where we're not completely reliant on Rooney and there's more of a team emphasis for the likes of Wilshere, Sterling and Kane to step up. Vent, vent, vent.
 

mistermagic

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,989
Likes
635
Supports
Stoke City (I don't make the rules, Epic73 does)
Twitter
@FinallyFifou
#20
Rooney is the problem. He's not a CF and doesn't play very well as a second striker for England as he does for Man Utd. Drop the 4231 and the #10 position to go 433 and play with Kane up top (who's an actual CF). After Gerrard & Lampard, England still have this tendency to pick player's on reputation and not performances while playing for England. It's like the axe doesn't fall on certain players.
Of course, Hodgson won't have the balls to drop him, he'll play every minute even though he'll be knackered from a long, hard season, won't perform as usual (as Lee correctly stated on numerous occasions, Euro 2004 was his only decent tournament) and England will go out on penalties.
 
Messages
1,891
Likes
1,947
Location
Bet365
Supports
Coral.co.uk & Ladbrokes.com
Twitter
@taylorswift13
#21
Rooney is the problem. He's not a CF and doesn't play very well as a second striker for England as he does for Man Utd. Drop the 4231 and the #10 position to go 433 and play with Kane up top (who's an actual CF). After Gerrard & Lampard, England still have this tendency to pick player's on reputation and not performances while playing for England. It's like the axe doesn't fall on certain players.
Of course, Hodgson won't have the balls to drop him, he'll play every minute even though he'll be knackered from a long, hard season, won't perform as usual (as Lee correctly stated on numerous occasions, Euro 2004 was his only decent tournament) and England will go out on penalties.
Reputation and not performances.

How many goals does Rooney have to score to be selected? Two per game?
 

Leewilson

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
3,954
Likes
1,719
Supports
Dagenham and Redbridge
#22
Reputation and not performances.

How many goals does Rooney have to score to be selected? Two per game?
How many goals has he scored in international tournaments since 2004? Fuck the qualifiers because in all honesty, we can play any of the strikers we call up up top and they'd most likely score a half decent return of goals in them. Look at Crouch's record for example.
 

Murphy

Bloody Nice Chap
Messages
2,139
Likes
1,189
Location
Norwich
Supports
Dagenham & Redbridge and Stephen Mulhern.
Twitter
@NickMurphy1995
#25
See I'm still unconvinced by Chamberlain. He's shown plenty of promise but just doesn't do enough for me. If we're playing 4-2-3-1 I'd rather see Walcott and Sterling as the two wide players.
I'd be reluctant to start Walcott. Unless we did so in a three pronged attack, Walcott on one side, Ox on the other with the main guy through the middle (Kane/Rooney/Sturridge) - absolutely love that approach where you've got two pacey players who like to drive on either side with one out and out forward through the middle, applied correctly it can be so effective.

As for Walcott or the Ox, I'd be more tempted with the Ox if it's only one of them starting. Not only is the Ox stronger, I also find the way he drives forward far more effective than Walcott who seems very hit and miss, and on some occasions that he's almost too fast for the ball. When Walcott's on form, he's unbelievable - but that rarely comes against top level opposition, and although that's a criticism that can probably be applied to the majority of the team, I feel as though the Ox has proven himself better in those situations compared to Walcott. Performances against Brazil and France in particular spring to mind in recent memory. And just from watching Arsenal on Monday night, they had a new dimension when he was introduced and looked far more likely to score, as they did when he played from the start against West Ham on the opening day, the only man who looked like he could create something, almost out of nothing. It's just the way he carries the ball, I don't think England have enough players like that.

It's a similar sort of thing with Ross Barkley. When he's got an effective partnership and both him and Lukaku are on form for Everton, they and he in particular look like a different proposition. Having players that can work in tandem is so key for me, and if Barkley continues to get playing time at Everton as the Ox so desperately needs to do at Arsenal then there's some real promise there.
 

mente captus

Well-Known Member
Messages
941
Likes
366
Location
cologne
Supports
wins
#26
How many goals has he scored in international tournaments since 2004? Fuck the qualifiers because in all honesty, we can play any of the strikers we call up up top and they'd most likely score a half decent return of goals in them. Look at Crouch's record for example.
he scored only one goal against a european top team, the Netherlands in 2006 and only four vs the top ten of the FIFA Ranking, 2x vs Brazil and one vs Argentina (+ the goal vs the Netherlands)
 
Messages
1,891
Likes
1,947
Location
Bet365
Supports
Coral.co.uk & Ladbrokes.com
Twitter
@taylorswift13
#27
I guess the issue is that people are bored with him?

He's played for an England side that hasn't got anywhere near a major final. I get why people want to dump him off, but getting rid of one of England's top scorers and most capped players when he's 29 seems a bit severe. I guess it's all academic anyway, as there's no way any manager will drop him.
 

mistermagic

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,989
Likes
635
Supports
Stoke City (I don't make the rules, Epic73 does)
Twitter
@FinallyFifou
#28
I think people are bored with him not performing. If he was playing superb stuff people wouldn't complain but he hasn't for most of his internatlonal career.
 

Ebeneezer Goode

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,646
Likes
1,539
Supports
England
#29
If he's definitely our best option up front then replacing him will only prove that. While qualification is practically in the bag I don't see the problem with doing that.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
14,936
Messages
923,609
Members
5,090
Latest member
Bordon Shot