Time Wasters v The Unbeatables (Carlisle v Plymouth)

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #1
If you were around on TFF earlier in the season, you may remember hellogregory was mocked for predicting a Carlisle win in the reverse fixture. We did of course lose the game, and with that, all of HG's remaining optimism.

Midweek seen us labelled 'time-wasting cheats' by many Burton fans as we grabbed an unexpected, but very important point.

This is certainly winnable, in my opinion, as Plymouth aren't the best attacking side in the league, with us scoring one more goal than them this season (51 to 50). However, they do have one of the better defensive records in the division, so there may be a lack of goals in this game.

Win this and we are all but safe, but if we lose and other results go against us we will be looking nervously over our shoulders.

A draw would be decent regardless of other results, but I think we'll get a narrow win which would seal our safety.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#2
We'd won the previous 3 games, conceding none, so I don't think it was that ambitious predicting a win. The way their fans reacted to the cheek of me suggesting we'd win, you'd think I'd done a shit on their dead relatives grave or something!

As for the game, I think Wednesday night will have taken it's toll on us. The shift they put in for nearly 2 hours of football, the extra days recovery Plymouth have had... It all points to a Plymouth win.

We have to hope that other teams don't capitalise, because if the gap gets reduced to 3, there's going to be mad panic again with 2 games left. This is why I think we'll go down, if we leave it until the last day of the season to get those crucial points to take us over the line, I don't think we'll get them and I thinkHartlepool will profit from it.
 

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #4
Fantastic performance, probably the best of the season.

The entire team played their part, Dempsey was instrumental, Kennedy and Dicker were brilliant, as was the entire defence. Atkinson and Young have both massively improved, and Grainger is playing better. Paynter worked his socks off, and took his goal well.

Credit to Keith Curle, the new system is working to perfection.

7pts out of 9, only conceded 1 in that time, and we have cruised to safety.
 

daviejones

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,487
Likes
233
Supports
Carlisle Utd
#6
Sounded like he wanted to come when he was interviewed the other day. Wouldn't be surprised if other teams were in for him after his performances, but I think he likes it here, he's spent most of his career up north and probably just wants game time at this stage.
 

shoddycollins

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,838
Likes
2,420
Location
In the Chris Beech wonderland
Supports
Carlisle United
#7
Sounded like he wanted to come when he was interviewed the other day. Wouldn't be surprised if other teams were in for him after his performances, but I think he likes it here, he's spent most of his career up north and probably just wants game time at this stage.
Yeah a Middlesbrough lad, they tend to enjoy life in Carlisle.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#8
Brilliant performance. They started well but once we got a foothold of the game we were fairly comfortable and probablu could have scored more.

Atkinson was excellent at CB, Dicker and Kennedy were immense, great goal by Dicker and I liked the partnership of Dempsey and Paynter up front.
 

shoddycollins

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,838
Likes
2,420
Location
In the Chris Beech wonderland
Supports
Carlisle United
#9
I did fear the worst after the first 15-20 minutes. Plymouth did look very good, their quality players had us on the back foot, Chris Lumsdon said in a resigned voice on the radio 'they're simply better than us' and I was rethinking my opinion on the best team I've seen us play this season. Against the run of play we had the best chance of the opening period when Steven Rigg found himself with the ball at his feet but it was well saved by McCormack before Rigg hit the post with the rebound. Plymouth's pressure continued, Bobby Reid, Holmes-Dennis and Alessandra all looked unplayable and losing Asamoah to injury I thought deprived us of our only positive outlet.

However Potts did well after coming on and Dempsey looked good playing up front and the pressure on us eased a little bit. Dicker scored a worldy (watch it on FLS if you get the chance) and while I still felt quite tense about making it to half-time 1-0 up Plymouth didn't threaten us much although they had more of the ball, just one cross-cum-shot which Gillespie palmed around the post. Our wing-backs Brough and Young both had very good games and really cut off Plymouth's main supply lines at the source. Slight controversy at the very end, a lunge from Atkinson which the BBCRC commentators thought should have been a penalty to Plymouth, despite no Plymouth player claiming for one, and then a Plymouth corner which should have been on the stroke of half-time but the ref decided they were taking too long over it and blew the whistle before they could take it.

There was a bit of a tussle between players and staff in the tunnel on half time, centred on Peter Hartley and our goalkeeping coach Tony Caig. According to Lumsdon the two of them have a history.

Second half we came out and started playing with much more comfort. Plymouth backed off us and pretty much any threat that they would score ended there and then. Apparently they've had a problem this season in coming back from behind, and it showed, they suddenly looked like they didn't know how to score a goal when they absolutely needed one. We were allowed to string passes together, Dempsey and Potts linked up to good effect, and then a ball forward from Potts, held up brilliantly by Dempsey and played to Paynter was slotted home coolly from the corner of the box, prompting Luke McCormack to berate his defenders.

After that we could have had a couple more to add some real gloss to the result, Potts dragged a shot just wide of the post while O'Hanlon had a great chance from a corner and Dempsey could have scored too. We finished the game with slightly less than 50% possession, probably on account of the amount of the ball Plymouth had in the first half, but in the second half we were at times able to keep the ball away from them with relative ease, Kyle Dempsey even pleasing the home fans with a bit of showboating. There was a penalty claim after Rueben Reid tangled with Mark Gillespie that only saw Reid booked for what the referee deemed to be simulation. The atmosphere was great throughout as the tension (never bank on Carlisle winning a game even when 2-0 up) subsided. Plymouth had the ball in the back of the net at one point but it was chalked out for being offside while Mark Gillespie pulled off a brilliant point-blank save only to find out that too was offside and that was the last we really saw of their attackers. They started to put the ball out of play with a regularity that must have caused the traveling Green Army much despair and we pretty much coasted home singing all the way.

There was more pushing and shoving in the tunnel at the final whistle.

So it was a great performance, great result. If only we could have played like that all season. Dicker and Paynter both looked exactly like the players we hoped they would be when they were our marquee signings of the summer and thankfully most of our young players are signed up for next season because they put in performances that might have interested any watching scouts.

Decent atmosphere even if there were a lot of people around me who had been missing all season long, only to turn up when there was a chance we might have something to celebrate, and then had the cheek to sing 'loyal supporters'.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#10
We made 3 top quality signings (on paper at least) in the summer from higher levels.
Troy Archibald-Henville
Billy Paynter
Gary Dicker

Only Troy has shown his worth but today Dicker and Paynter were top drawer. They both showed their class, not just because they scored but their all round performances were almost faultless.

If we can get them 2 performing next season, we might actually do something.
 

daviejones

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,487
Likes
233
Supports
Carlisle Utd
#11
The formation seems to be a winner as well and single handedly solves the problem we've been having with lack of wingers by just eliminating them. It suits Brough perfectly and he could really cement his place in the team there next season, I would almost say that he's more useful to us than Potts at the moment.
 

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #12
Was a great atmosphere today, best in a while. All of the players deservedly got applauded off the pitch, and they looked happy.

I have high hopes for next season, and I think this new system could work too. Dicker could be a key player next season, and Kennedy would be a great addition. Two solid midfielders. Dempsey is a class above, and looked comfortable up top.

O'Hanlon played very well again, as did the other 4 defenders. Add Troy into that defence and we should be a lot better defensively next season.
If we can keep Gillespie fit, he could also shore up the defence, as he showed today and midweek.

Looking forward to the Hartlepool game already :)
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#13
I find it quite amusing reading/hearing our fans saying so and so should get a new contract etc.

We need to get shot of loads, changes are needed especially at the back. I'd release O'Hanlon. A few good games shouldn't hide the fact that he's been shite for a season and a half. We can get better.
 

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #14
I wouldn't say 'a few games', he's been consistent for most of Curle's reign. He's been one of our better players this season, in my opinion, and should at least be a back up.

He hasn't been much worse than Troy A.H, who gets slightly overrated by most of our fans. The fact he's been out injured/suspended for so many games means we need strong back up.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#15
Troy isn't out of contract though, O'Hanlon is. And O'Hanlon was shite in the first half of this season, he was (rightly) transfer listed remember

Would you be happy going into next season with the exact same defence?
 

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #16
Nope, if we were to stick with the 5 at the back I'd go with:

Right Wing Back - Young played well today but I'd probably prefer a new, permanent signing.

Left Wing Back - I'd keep playing Brough as he has been very good in the past month. His pace is useful and he is one of our better crosses.

Centre Backs - O'Hanlon, Troy A.H and a new signing would be good enough in my opinion. Atkinson was decent today but I don't think he's what we'll need. Meppen Walter could slot in, or replace O'Hanlon, but Curle may see his future in midfield.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#17
I think we've got a couple of good young centre backs in CMW and Buddle, and a good experienced centre back in Troy. Grainger is obviously proving he can be competent in a back 5. I think we need another experienced one, if that means releasing O'Hanlon then so be it.

I agree that right back needs to be a priority. I really liked Hayden White, offers so much going forward as well. I don't know his situation at Bolton but I'd like us to sign him. Him on one side and Brough on the other would give us pace and end product on either side in this formation.
 

daviejones

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,487
Likes
233
Supports
Carlisle Utd
#18
Meppen Walter is exactly what we need in this system. We lose one player in midfield playing 3 in centre back but he would come close to making up for it with his passing range, the two assists against Tranmere for Wyke stand out as proof that he could be the one in the back 3 who sprays the ball out with the other two being the more solid defensively.

Agree on Hayden White as well but we've absolutely no chance there. Seem to remember Bolton paid a decent fee for him not too long ago and he's just turned 20 a few days ago so they'll be waiting at least another season to see if they can get anything out of him I would have thought.

In terms of who I would keep next season in the defence, it's clear that there needs to be a change here although the players are getting used to this new formation quite nicely. Brough for me has made that left wing back spot his now, no need to sign anyone else there especially when Grainger can cover at left back in a 442 if Brough gets injured. Right wing back definitely needs a new signing, no idea who.

Centre back is a tough one. We need depth so, provided he's on a lowish wage, i'd keep O'Hanlon. My first choice for the back 3 would probably be CMW, Troy and Buddle although Grainger is captain and is likely to have a pretty certain starting spot. As much as I love him I get the feeling that we'll struggle again if we're always just waiting for Troy to come back or hoping that he isn't injured for the next game. I'd rather give a consistent back 3 a go and see how they fare. So my back 3 would be CMW - Grainger - Buddle.
 

cufc17

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Messages
2,315
Likes
476
Location
Carlisle
Supports
Carlisle
Thread starter #19
I don't think I've seen Buddle play yet, so can't comment on him although he sounded decent against Burton and Oxford.

Both Hayden White and Connor Brown tweeted earlier praising us for securing safety. White would maybe be a possibility on loan, especially if we could get him playing like he did in his 1st month with us.
 

shoddycollins

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,838
Likes
2,420
Location
In the Chris Beech wonderland
Supports
Carlisle United
#20
I don't think I've seen Buddle play yet, so can't comment on him although he sounded decent against Burton and Oxford.

Both Hayden White and Connor Brown tweeted earlier praising us for securing safety. White would maybe be a possibility on loan, especially if we could get him playing like he did in his 1st month with us.
I feel we might see him now that we're safe, keep playing the way we've been playing but drop Atkinson to the bench for Buddle and give him some game time. From what I've heard he's well up for playing against Hartlepool (apparently he's been on Twitter 'liking' tweets people have posted about Hartlepool going down).

O'Hanlon has been a decent League 1/SPL standard centre-back for a few years now and at 32 age shouldn't be an issue. He was poor under Kav and took a while to get his form back under Curle but I see no reason why he couldn't do a job in a League 2 promotion push, even if we do want to keep our eyes peeled for other options.
 

daviejones

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,487
Likes
233
Supports
Carlisle Utd
#21
I feel we might see him now that we're safe, keep playing the way we've been playing but drop Atkinson to the bench for Buddle and give him some game time. From what I've heard he's well up for playing against Hartlepool (apparently he's been on Twitter 'liking' tweets people have posted about Hartlepool going down).
Buddle said as soon as he came here that he wouldn't give a shit about relegating them (not in those words of course) and since then has favourited the odd tweet about it - the first I can find was after the Burton game 'Relegate Pools final day mate. Well played tonight'. Surely means it would be a smart move to let him play that game as he'd be right up for it, looks a tidy player as well who should definitely be kept on next year.
 

BigDaveCUFC

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,667
Likes
540
Supports
Curzon Ashton....and Carlisle
#23
Well firstly the game was very enjoyable on Saturday, we played extremely well, won comfortably and the atmosphere for first time in couple of years was positive.

Worried in the opening 15 minutes as Plymouth went right at us from the start and we seemed stuck into that plodding defensive mode, but about the 15 minute mark they slacked in defence and really we should have scored with rig I think it was completely free infront of goal, but he delayed, got closed down then hit the post which left it still 0-0, but that lifted the spirit in the team and from that moment on it was all us.

Plymouth seemed very very lazy and lethargic which was surprising considering they pretty much HAD to win, but we got helped in a way by a ref who was in that 'try and not give anything' mode so we could battle and scrap and Plymouth frankly didn't like getting stuck in, which again was surprising since they looked a big bulky looking set of players. Maybe they thought they could turn up and win easy and if they did think that they deserve to finish outside top 7 in 2 weeks for that attitude.

but everything also clicked for us and Asamoah played excellent in that early part to drag us back into it causing them lots of problems before unfortunately injury took him off the pitch which was frustrating as it again unsettled us for a while, thankfully while we stopped creating we did score, a good thumping shot by Dicker. We lost Rigg up front just as he was starting to get into the game and had to bring on Paynter which seemed abit of a worry with our forward line now a midfielder and a badly out of form forward.

but to be honest the game just continued with us on top of play, cutting them off and creating good opportunities. Early 2nd half Paynter scored which gave him a huge boost in confidence and then we had a team all buzzing about until about 10 minutes to go when tiredness crept in, but while Plymouth got more into it they never really did enough to warrant a goal or create a chance for one apart from a header I think near the end. If they had scored it would have seen a panic stricken mess, but that vital 2nd goal meant we didn't do the disastrous sit-back job of previous games.


so we're safe and deserved on the performance, but I do worry already at our fanbases usual reply to an odd good performance, that suddenly these 'wasters' are all good enough and we should keep the lot, its been a terrible season from a badly underperforming side which should have easily been a top 10 side, but for bad management, constant tinkering, a stinking attitude in the players behind the scenes, terrible atmosphere and a totally and utterly disjointed set-up......a lot of thinking now needs to be done over the next 3-4 weeks on how we do move forward.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#24
but I do worry already at our fanbases usual reply to an odd good performance, that suddenly these 'wasters' are all good enough and we should keep the lot,
This is my concern as well. That's why I'd release O'Hanlon, despite him playing well of late. He's the only central defender out of contract, so take the opportunity to free up a wage. Goal scoring hasn't really been the issue, it's defensively where we've failed this season. It needs sorted, a proper right back or 2, and a new centre back.
 

Saddlerrad

Administrator
Staff member
Admin
Moderator
Messages
4,077
Likes
1,104
Location
Staffordshire
Supports
Walsall
#27
Seems Curle's volley of abuse a few weeks ago has provoked a reaction out of your players. Surely proven a few people wrong going by the comments from your fans under that article a few weeks back.

Impressive going.
 

daviejones

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,487
Likes
233
Supports
Carlisle Utd
#28
The interview certainly helped a lot but I also think the new found form is in no small part down to Dicker returning. He reads the game better than most at this level - whether it be picking out smart passes or just dropping the shoulder to turn a midfielder, some of it you just get used to players not being able to do. With him in the team all season we probably would have been safer a lot sooner but i'm not too fussed about that now, I just hope that he can play as big a part as he has the potential to next year in what could be a much better season.

Another good thing to see was players organising their own meetings without the manager having to do it all. Curle's talk obviously made them all realise how unacceptable their performances had been and quite rightly so, but they could quite easily all have just carried on like that and not faced up to the reality of relegation - after all, some of them are on 2 year contracts and have a guaranteed job next year either way, albeit probably with a slight relegation wage decrease. I like to think Curle knew this would happen when he lamented them, and if that is the case then maybe he's a better manager than I give him credit for.
 

Jabba the gut

Active Member
Messages
148
Likes
103
Location
London
Supports
Exeter City FC
#29
The interview certainly helped a lot but I also think the new found form is in no small part down to Dicker returning. He reads the game better than most at this level - whether it be picking out smart passes or just dropping the shoulder to turn a midfielder, some of it you just get used to players not being able to do. With him in the team all season we probably would have been safer a lot sooner but i'm not too fussed about that now, I just hope that he can play as big a part as he has the potential to next year in what could be a much better season.

Another good thing to see was players organising their own meetings without the manager having to do it all. Curle's talk obviously made them all realise how unacceptable their performances had been and quite rightly so, but they could quite easily all have just carried on like that and not faced up to the reality of relegation - after all, some of them are on 2 year contracts and have a guaranteed job next year either way, albeit probably with a slight relegation wage decrease. I like to think Curle knew this would happen when he lamented them, and if that is the case then maybe he's a better manager than I give him credit for.
How has Troy been for you lot? He was sheer class at City - I would have him back tomorrow.
 

hellogregory

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,011
Likes
1,053
Supports
Carlisle United
#30
How has Troy been for you lot? He was sheer class at City - I would have him back tomorrow.
Class. He's immense when he plays. He was injured at the start of the season, but he's been pretty reliable since then until he got suspended for 4 matches for fighting last week. He's also had the misfortune of playing in a shit team, but without him we'd have been relegated by March.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
14,939
Messages
923,742
Members
5,090
Latest member
Bordon Shot