"Rooney rule" in Football league...

[Super_horns]

Football league bringing in a system akin to the above to help black footballers get into coaching/management.

Its a long running debate and will this help?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/33015657

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

So they want to fight institutionalized racism they think might exist with their own form of institutionalized racism.

 

[Mr Elmo]

I don't agree with it.

Coaches and managers should be picked on merit and skills, not on their skin colour. If black people want to get into football more, or anyone else for that matter, they should learn their way up and start at the bottom. The only reason not many are picked now is because clubs don't think they are good enough, they're trying to create a problem with something which isn't a problem really.

Could cause quite a few unnecessary problems.

 

[Habbinalan]

I don't agree with it.

Coaches and managers should be picked on merit and skills, not on their skin colour. If black people want to get into football more, or anyone else for that matter, they should learn their way up and start at the bottom. The only reason not many are picked now is because clubs don't think they are good enough, they're trying to create a problem with something which isn't a problem really.

Could cause quite a few unnecessary problems.

But I thought the requirement is not to make an appointment but just to provide the opportunity of an interview - and it only applies at the lower level of coaches and academy staff, not manager appointments. Am I wrong?

 

[Veggie Legs]

But I thought the requirement is not to make an appointment but just to provide the opportunity of an interview - and it only applies at the lower level of coaches and academy staff, not manager appointments. Am I wrong?

You're definitely correct about the first bit, the article posted seems contradictory on the second.

Personally I don't have a problem with the proposals: if the problem for black managers trying to get jobs is lack of opportunity then this should help to solve that. If it's that their skills or experience are lacking then they still won't get the job, so it's not like weaker candidates will be getting appointed when they wouldn't currently.

 

[yellow]

Does this mean people like Sol Campbell have won?

 

[SUTSS]

I'm skeptical as to whether this will make any meaningful difference. I think there is an issue with BME players not seeing coaching as a viable end of career choice and this could go some way to address that but this seems like quite a heavy handed way of doing it.

 

[Habbinalan]

...... the article posted seems contradictory on the second.

I understood it was going to be "voluntary" for manager appointments, whatever that means. I guess some appointments are made at that level without formal competitive interviews?

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Just wait for the outburst from Sol Campbell after he's attended his 13th managerial interview and not got a job...

 

[Veggie Legs]

I understood it was going to be "voluntary" for manager appointments, whatever that means. I guess some appointments are made at that level without formal competitive interviews?

Sounds like you're correct.
"Adopt a Voluntary Recruitment Code for first team football under which clubs would commit to interview a BAME candidate (where an application has been received) for any managerial or coaching position except in the specific instance of an individual being recruited from another club on terms agreed between the two parties. It is anticipated this would be piloted by 5-10 clubs during 2016/17 ahead of wider adoption."
(From Sky Sports)

 

[zanderpne]

Don't know much about it but isn't it just giving shit minority managers jobs over better qualified white managers?

 

[SF_]

It's literally the worst 'rule' i've ever heard.

 

[Habbinalan]

Don't know much about it but isn't it just giving shit minority managers jobs over better qualified white managers?

No.

 

[Habbinalan]

It's literally the worst 'rule' i've ever heard.

What! Even the current offside rule?

 

[TomPNE94]

Why don't they have to interview an Asian candidate? Or a gay candidate? Stupid rule.

 

[infidel]

One rule for all. If your not good enough black white yellow should never come into it,your not good enough simple.

 

[Habbinalan]

Why don't they have to interview an Asian candidate? Or a gay candidate? Stupid rule.

They DO have to interview either a black or Asian candidate if there are applications from them. It would already be illegal to not interview a gay candidate solely on the basis that they were gay.

 

[Habbinalan]

One rule for all. If your not good enough black white yellow should never come into it, your not good enough simple.

That sounds like a good basis for deciding who to appoint.

 

[Womble98]

The argument is that BME people don't get the chance to be interviewed solely because of their race, not because of their footballing managerial skills or whatever.

 

[Mr Elmo]

I never said the requirement was to sign on a black manager or coach, but even to get an interview you have to be good enough for the job.

 

[hodge]

Won't make a difference, if they weren't good enough to get a job/interview before hand, they still won't get the job now if they're required to give an interview.

 

[Veggie Legs]

Won't make a difference, if they weren't good enough to get a job/interview before hand, they still won't get the job now if they're required to give an interview.

Unless there are other factors involved that reduce the chance of them getting an interview...

 

[ArmchairDiehard]

How many clubs that sack their manager already have a replacement lined up?

Imagine a team is battling relegation with five or six games to go and a club KNOW who they want but have to go through the whole application process before appointing the same man they were going to appoint anyway? The club could lose another two games in that time and be in even greater danger of relegation.

 

[Habbinalan]

How many clubs that sack their manager already have a replacement lined up?

Imagine a team is battling relegation with five or six games to go and a club KNOW who they want but have to go through the whole application process before appointing the same man they were going to appoint anyway? The club could lose another two games in that time and be in even greater danger of relegation.

That would need to be accommodated, both for temporary and permanent appointments . I don't think it's an issue if there is a targeted recruitment rather than an "open to applications" appointment. There would be no "applications received."

Sounds like you're correct.
"Adopt a Voluntary Recruitment Code for first team football under which clubs would commit to interview a BAME candidate (where an application has been received) for any managerial or coaching position except in the specific instance of an individual being recruited from another club on terms agreed between the two parties. It is anticipated this would be piloted by 5-10 clubs during 2016/17 ahead of wider adoption."
(From Sky Sports)

 

[Womble98]

Won't make a difference, if they weren't good enough to get a job/interview before hand, they still won't get the job now if they're required to give an interview.

Do you not listen? The argument isn't that black managers are shit, it is that they aren't given a chance to be interviewed because they are black. It has nothing to do with their managerial abilities.

 

[SF_]

I presume if a black or asian person doesn't apply for the job then this rule is void? or are they expecting football clubs to contact managers and coaches themselves in order to meet a quota? as in a 'you're black, you'll do', forced, patronising sort of way?

 

[TomPNE94]

Do you not listen? The argument isn't that black managers are shit, it is that they aren't given a chance to be interviewed because they are black. It has nothing to do with their managerial abilities.

....in your opinion.

 

[Habbinalan]

I presume if a black or asian person doesn't apply for the job then this rule is void? or are they expecting football clubs to contact managers and coaches themselves in order to meet a quota? as in a 'you're black, you'll do', forced, patronising sort of way?

Why would you think that?

 

[SF_]

Also, If 6 black managers out of 72 isn't good enough, what amount is acceptable? baring in mind black people are a minority in the UK.

 

[SF_]

Why would you think that?

The plans will see clubs interview one black minority ethnic (BME) candidate for each head coach or manager role from the 2016-17 season.

You can't interview one black minority ethnic, if one black minority ethnic doesn't want an interview.