Altrincham appoint Neil Young as Manager

Sparrow

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
2,911
Reaction score
1,555
Points
113
Supports
Woking FC
Appoint Neil Young as manager.
 

eightiesrobin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
564
Points
113
Supports
Altrincham
Had he not made such a balls of County, I'd have been fairly excited about this. As it is, I greet the news with hope rather than expectation
 

eightiesrobin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
564
Points
113
Supports
Altrincham
I wonder if he'll do a Kristian Dennis on Damien Reeves?
 

Ellis

Active Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
291
Reaction score
103
Points
43
Supports
Stockport County
Interesting contrast with his statement at Alty compared to when he took over us.

"...There are lads here with a lot of Conference North and Conference National experience who can form the basis of a good squad.
'Some people might expect me to come in and rip everything up, but I'll look carefully at the budget and the players we've got over the next couple of days before deciding the way forward."

"The harsh reality is that we need to build a squad capable of challenging for promotion, and to do that we need a major overhaul to free up as much of the budget as possible to create a squad good enough.

"We finished 30 points off the top of this league last season and if we just add five or six bodies to what we already have that will leave us short of were we need to be.

The ironic part of that statement is that if he had actually added 5 or 6 more on top of our old squad we would probably be in the playoffs now.

All I can say is I hope he gets your player recruitment right first time round because he will be incapable of coaching or tactics to get the best out of the players he signed. The difference in Gannon coming in and him has been chalk and cheese in that regard.

Hope he has learnt his lessons from us to improve himself. Though I hope he doesn't resort to using Carl Garner for you who seems more interested typing in emojis on Twitter and waxing about how he found Vardy first than signing competitive players in this division.
 

Sparrow

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
2,911
Reaction score
1,555
Points
113
Supports
Woking FC
Edited the title to make it bit more clearer. Hope you dont mind.

200.gif
 

SamScfc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
192
Points
63
Location
Stockport
Supports
Stockport
Twitter
@samcharnock94
I think it's a great appointment. He made his mistakes with us in the summer, the biggest one was getting rid of 2 strikers that can score at this level, and replacing them with 3 who never have and falling out with one in September.

At the start of the season we looked hard to beat with a solid defence, and capable of nicking goals and dominated the midfield with Ledsham, Rule and Montrose, then as soon as Rule got a 10 game ban we seemed to fall apart.

He just made so many unnecessary changes, letting Thorniley go back to Everton and bringing Paul Connolly in his place meaning we had 2 old CB's and no pace, he used about 43 players, and signed Dale Tonge.

He's a good manager who I think was tactically good, I didn't actually want him to go as I thought he'd learn his lesson and be up there next season, so I sort of felt sorry for him in the end with the bad luck we had, he tried so hard to get it right, but like I said, his mistake was letting Dennis go and we never recovered.
 

Ellis

Active Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
291
Reaction score
103
Points
43
Supports
Stockport County
I think it's a great appointment. He made his mistakes with us in the summer, the biggest one was getting rid of 2 strikers that can score at this level, and replacing them with 3 who never have and falling out with one in September.

At the start of the season we looked hard to beat with a solid defence, and capable of nicking goals and dominated the midfield with Ledsham, Rule and Montrose, then as soon as Rule got a 10 game ban we seemed to fall apart.

He just made so many unnecessary changes, letting Thorniley go back to Everton and bringing Paul Connolly in his place meaning we had 2 old CB's and no pace, he used about 43 players, and signed Dale Tonge.

He's a good manager who I think was tactically good, I didn't actually want him to go as I thought he'd learn his lesson and be up there next season, so I sort of felt sorry for him in the end with the bad luck we had, he tried so hard to get it right, but like I said, his mistake was letting Dennis go and we never recovered.

See I would disagree about him being tactically good. He was versed in the basics but he couldn't react to other changes during the game. He had a Plan A and when that Plan A worked (as it did in August - September) it looked great, but as soon as teams had us worked out and granted some bad luck the wheels truly fell off and he didn't know how to react to it.

Rather than look to his own potential failings in managing the game or changing tactics, he resorted to dropping players for making one or two minor (in the grand scheme of things) mistakes and signing the next best available player. I lost complete confidence when he dropped Morton completely for losing his man on a corner, slating him directly in an interview, then going out the following Monday and signing Dale Tonge. He was too stubborn to even bring Morton back into the team until his back was truly against the wall.

He made a lot of strange decisions and for once he is probably the first manager we can say caused his own downfall rather than a contribution of board turmoil or politics.
 

SamScfc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
192
Points
63
Location
Stockport
Supports
Stockport
Twitter
@samcharnock94
See I would disagree about him being tactically good. He was versed in the basics but he couldn't react to other changes during the game. He had a Plan A and when that Plan A worked (as it did in August - September) it looked great, but as soon as teams had us worked out and granted some bad luck the wheels truly fell off and he didn't know how to react to it.

Rather than look to his own potential failings in managing the game or changing tactics, he resorted to dropping players for making one or two minor (in the grand scheme of things) mistakes and signing the next best available player. I lost complete confidence when he dropped Morton completely for losing his man on a corner, slating him directly in an interview, then going out the following Monday and signing Dale Tonge. He was too stubborn to even bring Morton back into the team until his back was truly against the wall.

He made a lot of strange decisions and for once he is probably the first manager we can say caused his own downfall rather than a contribution of board turmoil or politics.

yeah I see what you mean, but I think his initial plan of 4-4-2, a big man upfront, a solid defence, a hard working midfield of Rule and Montrose and Ledsham joining in from the left worked really well, when we played FCUM away we were playing awful so he took Gonzales off after 20 mins, brought Baggie on who changed the game and we won, we weren't great to watch, but we were solid, people were crying out for us to dick teams 4-0 like Worcester at home but I always knew that wouldn't happen as weren't that type of team. It was only when we got all the injuries and suspensions where Young got exposed, I think if we didn't get a ridiculous amount of sendings off etc he'd be with us now, not to mention the amount of players that let him down, mainly Baggie.

Definitely agree with your point about Morton, but as the season has unfolded, it's sort of justified as Morton does look capable of costing us as Gannon had a little pop at him after the Corby game aswell.

What I think costed Young was making too many, unnecessary changes, too many loan signings, and the big one: not replacing Dennis. But I think he is a good manager.
 

Ellis

Active Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
Messages
291
Reaction score
103
Points
43
Supports
Stockport County
yeah I see what you mean, but I think his initial plan of 4-4-2, a big man upfront, a solid defence, a hard working midfield of Rule and Montrose and Ledsham joining in from the left worked really well, when we played FCUM away we were playing awful so he took Gonzales off after 20 mins, brought Baggie on who changed the game and we won, we weren't great to watch, but we were solid, people were crying out for us to dick teams 4-0 like Worcester at home but I always knew that wouldn't happen as weren't that type of team. It was only when we got all the injuries and suspensions where Young got exposed, I think if we didn't get a ridiculous amount of sendings off etc he'd be with us now, not to mention the amount of players that let him down, mainly Baggie.

Definitely agree with your point about Morton, but as the season has unfolded, it's sort of justified as Morton does look capable of costing us as Gannon had a little pop at him after the Corby game aswell.

What I think costed Young was making too many, unnecessary changes, too many loan signings, and the big one: not replacing Dennis. But I think he is a good manager.

In a way I think it's a bit unfair as I am trying to compare Young to Gannon in terms of tactics. Whether others rate or like Gannon or not, he is always going to be one of the better managers at this level from a coaching/tactics perspective by virtue of having a Continental Pro license and years in the football league both as a manager and player. Maybe Young for a Conference North team has the nous to do it, but that is definitely his level.

I think he might do well for Altrincham if he can get it right first time, but I wouldn't have the confidence in him to be the manager who can grab things by the scruff of the neck and pull it back together if you hit a blip in form/injuries etc; instead he seems to resort to tinkering and panic buying.

I think somebody else said it on the Yellowboard but he should have resigned after the Nantwich game as the writing was on the wall for everybody but him at that point. If he had done that we might have been able to salvage this season under Gannon given our recent form.
 

Who Needs Mourinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,948
Reaction score
290
Points
83
Supports
Stockport County
People like Sam seem to be forgetting it looked like we were heading towards a relegation battle if we had kept Young any longer. Gannon got more out of the squad assembled by Young than Young did himself, and he had a worse record than the much maligned Lord despite an decent increase in budget.

Tactically he was extremely naive and rigidly stuck to an old fashioned 442 week in week out instead changing personal from game to game in blind hope of it working. We had no attacking pattern of play whatsoever and despite being a big team and having a decent dead ball delivery we never looked a threat from set-pieces (I'm lead to believe we very rarely worked on them in training and boy did it show).

The striker situation is well documented for me it wasn't getting rid of Dennis that I had a huge problem with, it was the lack of a proven replacement that was the major issue. I'm sure he will look to keep Reeves and won't make the same mistake twice.

The one thing you can give him credit for is putting together a solid defence but as he was unable to sort out the goalscoring and discipline issues he decided to try and fix something that wasn't broke and made a right royal hash of that as well.

I agree he is fine as long you're on a good run but has absolutely no idea what to do if it goes wrong - his Chester success was built on money and momentum - Alty are coming down after relegation and I should imagine he will be working on a smaller budget than he had with us this season, so it doesn't bode well.
 

Railway Blue

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2015
Messages
2,989
Reaction score
472
Points
83
Location
Newton
Supports
Chester FC
Had he not made such a balls of County, I'd have been fairly excited about this. As it is, I greet the news with hope rather than expectation
I don't think he made a mess of County, they are seemingly a basket case. The Messiah didn't really improve things either. When Neil got there their budget was already spent on overpaid rubbish with the notable exception of Dennis, who was always injured up to the point that he went to Macc.
 

eightiesrobin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
564
Points
113
Supports
Altrincham
You could be right. I'm interested to see who he does and doesn't fancy among the current bunch, most of whom are out of contract.
 

Who Needs Mourinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,948
Reaction score
290
Points
83
Supports
Stockport County
I don't think he made a mess of County, they are seemingly a basket case. The Messiah didn't really improve things either. When Neil got there their budget was already spent on overpaid rubbish with the notable exception of Dennis, who was always injured up to the point that he went to Macc.
That is just not true - there were a handful of players on contracts (most of who could have played a part) and lots of the budget still available. He made a big song and dance about value for money but got rid of Dennis while still paying half his wages and then brought in a non-scoring striker in Odejayi on a bigger wage than Dennis was on.

As I said the messiah's record with Young's squad is better than his and Lord who was before him who had about 100k less to spend has a better record as well.

Of course County is a poisoned chalice but Young got everything he wanted, a huge backroom team, the biggest budget since we dropped to this division and unlike many other managers previous to him had no outside interference from anybody. He wasn't up to the job and to be fair to him he admitted as such and did the decent thing by going.
 

SamScfc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
192
Points
63
Location
Stockport
Supports
Stockport
Twitter
@samcharnock94
People like Sam seem to be forgetting it looked like we were heading towards a relegation battle if we had kept Young any longer. Gannon got more out of the squad assembled by Young than Young did himself, and he had a worse record than the much maligned Lord despite an decent increase in budget.

Tactically he was extremely naive and rigidly stuck to an old fashioned 442 week in week out instead changing personal from game to game in blind hope of it working. We had no attacking pattern of play whatsoever and despite being a big team and having a decent dead ball delivery we never looked a threat from set-pieces (I'm lead to believe we very rarely worked on them in training and boy did it show).

The striker situation is well documented for me it wasn't getting rid of Dennis that I had a huge problem with, it was the lack of a proven replacement that was the major issue. I'm sure he will look to keep Reeves and won't make the same mistake twice.

The one thing you can give him credit for is putting together a solid defence but as he was unable to sort out the goalscoring and discipline issues he decided to try and fix something that wasn't broke and made a right royal hash of that as well.

I agree he is fine as long you're on a good run but has absolutely no idea what to do if it goes wrong - his Chester success was built on money and momentum - Alty are coming down after relegation and I should imagine he will be working on a smaller budget than he had with us this season, so it doesn't bode well.

There's no way we would have gone down, I agree he's a limited manager but thought he had a lot of bad luck with us.
 

SamScfc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
192
Points
63
Location
Stockport
Supports
Stockport
Twitter
@samcharnock94
I don't think he made a mess of County, they are seemingly a basket case. The Messiah didn't really improve things either. When Neil got there their budget was already spent on overpaid rubbish with the notable exception of Dennis, who was always injured up to the point that he went to Macc.

The messiah didn't get it right? Are you sure? As mentioned we were threatening to get genuinely involved in a relegation battle, although as I said we wouldn't have gone down, Gannon's job was to get us out of that position and finish safely in mid table out of danger, but instead he gave us a genuine chance of the play offs, and if half our midfield didn't get injured/retire meaning we had to replace them with a 19 year old defender in holding midfield and an 18 year old who'd never played a senior game we could've sneaked in to 5th.
 

SamScfc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
192
Points
63
Location
Stockport
Supports
Stockport
Twitter
@samcharnock94
That is just not true - there were a handful of players on contracts (most of who could have played a part) and lots of the budget still available. He made a big song and dance about value for money but got rid of Dennis while still paying half his wages and then brought in a non-scoring striker in Odejayi on a bigger wage than Dennis was on.

As I said the messiah's record with Young's squad is better than his and Lord who was before him who had about 100k less to spend has a better record as well.

Of course County is a poisoned chalice but Young got everything he wanted, a huge backroom team, the biggest budget since we dropped to this division and unlike many other managers previous to him had no outside interference from anybody. He wasn't up to the job and to be fair to him he admitted as such and did the decent thing by going.

Surely Odejayi isn't on more than 700 a week?
 

Railway Blue

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2015
Messages
2,989
Reaction score
472
Points
83
Location
Newton
Supports
Chester FC
We'll see next season. I would love Stockport to come up, but it'll take 2 or 3 season's. If it's any consolation Youngie is better than Burr.
 

Who Needs Mourinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,948
Reaction score
290
Points
83
Supports
Stockport County
Surely Odejayi isn't on more than 700 a week?
I don't know figures but I'm lead to believe he was on more than Dennis - Gannon alluded to the fact that there was a group of overpaid ex league players on a lot of money with the rest of the squad on a pittance. He didn't think that was a healthy set-up especially with the performances of both sets of players being at a similar level.
 

Who Needs Mourinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,948
Reaction score
290
Points
83
Supports
Stockport County
We'll see next season. I would love Stockport to come up, but it'll take 2 or 3 season's. If it's any consolation Youngie is better than Burr.
I wouldn't be surprised if Young has learnt from his mistakes it certainly sounds like he is aware of them from what he said on the Alty website. However he will be working with a smaller budget in a stronger looking league so it's going to be hard for him.

I am quite surprised he wants another crack in football management tbh, he sounded like a beaten man when he left us and kinda hinted he would be looking at other roles in football.
 

eightiesrobin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2015
Messages
1,911
Reaction score
564
Points
113
Supports
Altrincham
I have thought that about Deasy for a while.

Moult is a keeper, Densmore did his knee this season, so you wonder how effective he'll be now. Richman tries hard but can't pass or score, Heathcote is very young.

Talk on the Alty forum about an unhappy squad, so I don't know who wants to stay. I can think of a few who have looked fat, disinterested or past it
 

Alty Pieman

Active Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2015
Messages
472
Reaction score
105
Points
43
Location
Alty
Supports
Alty
Had he not made such a balls of County, I'd have been fairly excited about this. As it is, I greet the news with hope rather than expectation
For once we agree. I'm told he was unlucky/undermined at Stockport, one things for sure, he wont be using 37 players at Alty! The board would have a fit :£ I dont know of any better candidate so just hope this works out, he did a great job at Chester, time will tell :dk:
 

Who Needs Mourinho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
1,948
Reaction score
290
Points
83
Supports
Stockport County
For once we agree. I'm told he was unlucky/undermined at Stockport, one things for sure, he wont be using 37 players at Alty! The board would have a fit :£ I dont know of any better candidate so just hope this works out, he did a great job at Chester, time will tell :dk:
Whoever told you is misinformed - though he does say he was undermined at Chester before leaving - don't beleive there is much proof of that though.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
15,957
Messages
1,087,441
Members
6,655
Latest member
Glover74
Top