Financing football 2020/21

THE LAST WALTZ

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No relegation from premiership is being muted but only in the event of another curtailed season.
 

LadyWomble

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I’m not so sure, I have more of a problem with the government handing out tax payers money to companies who reside in offshore tax havens.
With you on that one.
 

Indian Dan

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No relegation from premiership is being muted but only in the event of another curtailed season.
So, in effect, that means no promotion/relegation throughout the entire football pyramid.

Why bother carrying on playing. Might just as well shut up shop until fans can attend as before Covid.
 

PuB

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Yeah there’s literally no point if they cancel promotion and relegation, may as well mothball every club (like some clubs have decided to do in non league).
 

Kenneth E End

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Seems an announcement is coming soon ..we can but hope it does and without strings atached
I'm bored of the Premier League expecting something in return for this. The government need to be taking the lead and putting in place the necessary steps to regulate them accordingly.

If each PL team sacrified £10m each, it would solve this problem immediately.
 

PuB

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I'm bored of the Premier League expecting something in return for this. The government need to be taking the lead and putting in place the necessary steps to regulate them accordingly.

If each PL team sacrified £10m each, it would solve this problem immediately.
I’ve hinted at this earlier, but whilst I agree the PL is greedy and something needs to be done about it, I’m not sure how that’s related to the current crisis.

It’s a bit like expecting Tesco to help out your local corner shop because Tesco have a lot of money. The government are the ones who need to insist on financial regulation of the PL in the first place, but also support clubs and their local communities who miss out.

Stop spaffing tax payers money up the wall at on offshore businesses, wasting it on failed Covid related contracts, wasting millions on test and trace (when Ireland made a system months ago for just £700k, and it works), and start putting money where it will actually make a difference.

Edit: don’t listen to the governments bullshit about how it’s up to the Premier League to help us out, it’s a smoke screen because the govt can’t be arsed with our clubs.
 

That Fat Centre Half

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The Tesco logic doesn’t quite follow as they aren’t sending there apples and pears to ripen before selling them and Tesco aren’t also buying from there either.

The government also won’t do any of that, the entire ideology of this government in particular is to socialise losses and privatise profits.
 

THE LAST WALTZ

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Is anyone really surprised that Boris and his chums are happy to give one and a half billion to prop up the arts and culture but couldn’t give a flying fuck about football?
 

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Truth is last waltz is that there is enough money within the game to resolve the issues of the EFL Clubs. Premier league wages at £2000 million p.a. shows there is enough to go around in the game, it is just redistributed incorrectly/ unequally .Many have said this for years but it fell on deaf ears. The current crisis has sheds more light on it .

Write to your MP, get the message out there for the good of the game , not just for this current crisis but for the seasons that follow . It is too easy to come up with political assumptions, remember every bit of support ANY Govt gives for free is a cost to the tax payer either now or in the future. Your example of the arts is not the same as football - they are much more diverse and individual in set up and don't have corporate global mega TV deals that get distributed to the top 20 theatres
 

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As if to illustrate my point : source Deloitte. The total wages paid according to their report 2020 are as follows (2018/19)
Premier League (million) 3000 +
Championship 800
League I 153
League 2 71

Revenue in Premier league exceeded £5000 million

Plenty of scope for a small percentage levy on the value of their wages, they may be inclined to feel at little less generous, given some are paid in a week 3 times more even the best paid leaders of your local authority get in a whole year .

They have spiralled out of control and now fret about their own finances when gate receipts, so important for the EFL clubs, are for them, such a tiny proportion of their overall revenue.
 

Kenneth E End

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This is a really concerning report, but not surprising...



The Championship is reaping what its sewing and clubs like ours are going to suffer from it. Its unfair on clubs who want to cut their cloth and operate in a sustainable way.

(I know its the Sun) but look at the bottom of the list - being tarnished with the same brush as the Barnsley owner who is worth £7bn.

You certainly sympathise with them in regards to the massive advantage those with parachute payments have.

But the £3m we will lose from gate receipts and season tickets alone from not having spectators at grounds this season will be severe pain for us.
 

Indian Dan

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Surely, any bail out will have to be means tested. I’d imagine an amount would be lodged with the EFL and clubs apply for a grant, having to provide certain financial information to back up their application.

It’s difficult to just come out and say so and so owner is worth billions therefore he should fund his club. Some not so wealthy owners are as dodgy as fuck so handing over a wedge with no strings is a no no.
 

Kenneth E End

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I don't disagree on means testing, but at the same time, does a club in the same division deserve to get a different amount than another?

I think the only way is for clubs at all levels to submit forecasted numbers of what they would be bringing in on each matchday through normal gate receipts and season ticket sales - the PL underwrite 40% and the government underwrite 40%. I don't think commercial / sponsorship revenue, or F&B revenue can be counted unless they have a similar "eat out in the football club, to help out" scheme!

In the last full Championship season of having supporters, there were 10.8m fans in grounds (451k per club, although clubs like ours have a max capacity of around 240k per season). Lets say an average price of £16, taking into account concessions. The above equates to around £5.8m per club equally shared which equates to around £140m across the division. Based on means testing, I'd say we should be able to claim around £2.5m.
 

Kenneth E End

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It’s difficult to just come out and say so and so owner is worth billions therefore he should fund his club. Some not so wealthy owners are as dodgy as fuck so handing over a wedge with no strings is a no no.
But this is the PL - they don't want to spend anything on anyone else apart from themselves. And sadly, many managers are taking this same tone too.
 

Kenneth E End

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What is so frustrating is that in a normal year, nearly £4bn of money comes from TV broadcasting both at home and abroad in all domestic competitions.

I ran a spreadsheet a few months ago to sort of see how a redistributed model would help clubs thrive all the way through the pyramid. Based on these principles:

-Support redistribution through the divisions in a fairer way but at the same time, promote more of a merit based system and prize money for higher league placings.
-Eliminate parachute payments.
-Promote the cup competitions. The fact that there is zero prize money before the final in the League Cup is a joke. Give the FA Cup a proper winners cheque.
-Promote academies and reduce the impact of EPPP giving them meaningful funding.
-Promote the professionalism women's football.

Premier League - 67.5% (£2.4bn) - between £94m-£180m based on merit
Championship - 12.5% (£442m) - between £15m-£26m based on merit
League One - 4.5% (£159m) - between £5.6m-8.9m based on merit
League Two - 2% (£71m) - between £2.5m-£4m based on merit
National League - 0.45% (£16m) - between £600k-£900k.
National North / South - 0.1% (£3.5m) - around £80k each.
FA Competitions - 3.5% (£124m) - FA Cup winner £28m, £100k for R1 loser, £275k for R3 loser. FA Trophy winner £250k. FA Vase winner £25k. FA Youth Cup winner £500k. FA Women's Cup winner £750k.
EFL Cup - 1.125% (£40m) - winner £10m, £250k for R3 losers.
EFL Trophy - 0.125% (£4.4m) - winner £750k, £125k for quarter finalists
Academies - 2% (£71m) - depending on division equal shares of between £1.6m-£100k down to Conference level.
Womens SL & Champ - 1.2% (£42m) - around £2.3m for each SL club.
Grassroots - 2.5% (£88m)
Charity - 1.5% (£53m)
PFA - 1% (£35m)
Bank reserve - 10% (£393m)

*The numbers are based on a normal year - obviously with rebates this differs somewhat.

Its quite sad that such a small % of the money could have such a massive impact.
 

masi51

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What is so frustrating is that in a normal year, nearly £4bn of money comes from TV broadcasting both at home and abroad in all domestic competitions.

I ran a spreadsheet a few months ago to sort of see how a redistributed model would help clubs thrive all the way through the pyramid. Based on these principles:

-Support redistribution through the divisions in a fairer way but at the same time, promote more of a merit based system and prize money for higher league placings.
-Eliminate parachute payments.
-Promote the cup competitions. The fact that there is zero prize money before the final in the League Cup is a joke. Give the FA Cup a proper winners cheque.
-Promote academies and reduce the impact of EPPP giving them meaningful funding.
-Promote the professionalism women's football.

Premier League - 67.5% (£2.4bn) - between £94m-£180m based on merit
Championship - 12.5% (£442m) - between £15m-£26m based on merit
League One - 4.5% (£159m) - between £5.6m-8.9m based on merit
League Two - 2% (£71m) - between £2.5m-£4m based on merit
National League - 0.45% (£16m) - between £600k-£900k.
National North / South - 0.1% (£3.5m) - around £80k each.
FA Competitions - 3.5% (£124m) - FA Cup winner £28m, £100k for R1 loser, £275k for R3 loser. FA Trophy winner £250k. FA Vase winner £25k. FA Youth Cup winner £500k. FA Women's Cup winner £750k.
EFL Cup - 1.125% (£40m) - winner £10m, £250k for R3 losers.
EFL Trophy - 0.125% (£4.4m) - winner £750k, £125k for quarter finalists
Academies - 2% (£71m) - depending on division equal shares of between £1.6m-£100k down to Conference level.
Womens SL & Champ - 1.2% (£42m) - around £2.3m for each SL club.
Grassroots - 2.5% (£88m)
Charity - 1.5% (£53m)
PFA - 1% (£35m)
Bank reserve - 10% (£393m)

*The numbers are based on a normal year - obviously with rebates this differs somewhat.

Its quite sad that such a small % of the money could have such a massive impact.
Bank reserve £393m where is this money held?
Who owns it?

Why was it not used to save Bury/Macc?
 

Kenneth E End

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Bank reserve £393m where is this money held?
Who owns it?

Why was it not used to save Bury/Macc?
Rainy day fund (or in case of Covid), hurricane fund.
 

Luke Imp

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I think the PL are also reluctant to hand anything out until after the transfer window has closed to make sure the money goes on maintaining what's already at the Clubs rather than financing additions.

Feel sorry for the likes of Luton, Wycombe, Milwall and those who're run better than others and potentially being punished by association of others.
 

Observer

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Time to keeep the pressure on. Last week has been a huge step forward in bringing some sanity back to football finance. The so called big 6 power grab has been thrown into the dustbin. The promise of £250m was built on no certainty and sand. Thankfully this was seen and rejected.

Now we have everyone talking about the re-structuring ..there is nothing wrong with the structure that has been in place, the only issue is distribution of funds..

Quite simply the riches generated by the Premier league "project" need to be shared more equally across the football family . If that means the premier league cannot hand out £4-500000 weekly salaries then so be it ... surely any player can live and save for the future on £250000 a week..can't they? ... hardly the "peoples game" they claim it to be.

Someone must be able to work out a formulae so those clubs generating most income contribute more to the EFL fund as it woulds be unfair on smaller clubs like Sheffield United, Burnley.

A tax or levy on total salary spend for Premier league clubs at a percentage sufficient to generate £250 m for the EFL would seem to be the simplest . Premier league clubs would issue planned budget statement in close season. Once that is in place and the calculation done, then any overspend brings about additional tax at a higher rate. That would not stop those clubs spending more but they would have to make greater payments to the EFL under that additional tax.

The EFL must design a distribution process to protect it's clubs from financial exploitation by errant owners.
 

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