Oscar Pistorius - Murderer

[Bobbin']

Justice at last?

 

[Cheese & Biscuits]

Who knows?

On what I've seen/heard I think he's a murderer but I'm hardly an expert.

 

[Bobbin']

Yeah, same.

I find it very hard to believe that he didn't know that it was his own girlfriend in that bathroom. Also, I can't remember, what are the laws on shooting intruders in South Africa? Because there can be no doubt regardless of who he thought was behind that door, he was shooting to kill.

I'm still slightly surprised by the decision to change the charge to murder, thought the prosecution had no chance.

 

[Pagnell]

No surprise, or should I say there is no surprise he is guilty of murder rather than the original verdict being overturned, which is a surprise. We will never know for sure but I always had a hunch he knew she was in there. As I said more than once in the old TFF thread, the whole basis of his defence simply never stacked up for me and I was amazed he got as lenient a sentence as he did.

 

[AFCB_Mark]

Just makes you question why the verdict was originally given as it was.

 

[mowgli]

A single judge came up with the verdict of manslaughter, was she starstruck i wonder? Most people knew he murdered his girlfriend except the idiotic judge who should be sacked. I'm pleased that her family will. have some sort of justice after all they've been through.

 

[Pyeman]

I'm not sure what to think. His version of events seems unlikely, but equally I don't think it sounds like a premeditated thing. If it was premeditated it was certainly an innovative plan.

"I'll wait til she goes for a shit then shoot her on the bog. That'll teach her for using the last sheet of paper and not putting a fresh one out."

 

[Super_horns]

have new facts emerged or anything? confused as to the timing of this

Prosecution appealed the original verdict I think.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-34993002

 

[Pagnell]

I can't find reference to whether he will be back behind bars before he is sentenced, which it's said won't now be until next month at the earliest. Does that mean he will stay under house arrest until then, or be incarcerated pending that sentence? It's would surely be a bit strange to effectively be on remand pending a murder sentence after being found guilty, but not be in prison.

 

[slaphead]

I can't find reference to whether he will be back behind bars before he is sentenced, which it's said won't now be until next month at the earliest. Does that mean he will stay under house arrest until then, or be incarcerated pending that sentence? It's would surely be a bit strange to effectively be on remand pending a murder sentence after being found guilty, but not be in prison.

There was a piece earlier on the BBC News live feed that reported that he will return to prison today, but that has now gone. Sky News is reporting very little of the case either. All the various other news outlets I've seen today seem a little ambiguous on it.

 

[mowgli]

I'm not sure what to think. His version of events seems unlikely, but equally I don't think it sounds like a premeditated thing. If it was premeditated it was certainly an innovative plan.

"I'll wait til she goes for a shit then shoot her on the bog. That'll teach her for using the last sheet of paper and not putting a fresh one out."

I hadn't thought of that was why he got angry

 

[slaphead]

Or worse still, putting the bog roll on the wrong way round...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toilet_paper_orientation

Serious stuff, I can understand why he got annoyed.

 

[Pagnell]

There was a piece earlier on the BBC News live feed that reported that he will return to prison today, but that has now gone. Sky News is reporting very little of the case either. All the various other news outlets I've seen today seem a little ambiguous on it.

Imagine if he had been in the dock and been found guilty of murder. There is no way in hell he'd have been released pending the sentence, house arrest or not. So this really shouldn't be any different, logically he should be taken to prison today.

 

[slaphead]

I do find it a little strange we wasn't in court for the hearing, so should the verdict have gone this way he could have been carted back to pokey.

 

[Pagnell]

http://www.heraldlive.co.za/clear-yet-whether-pistorius-will-return-prison/

The only reference I can find, and it says it's not clear if he will remain under house arrest or be returned to prison. A bit strange if it isn't the latter, especially given that there is no clear date set for the sentencing. Effectively he's a convicted murderer out on license.

 

[blade1889]

Why does sentencing take so long? Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it very nearly immediate in the UK?

 

[Pagnell]

The funniest thing is that I've just read the judge who fucked up the original conviction is set to decide the sentence length.

 

[markpvfc]

Probably give him a couple of weeks sentence then.

 

[Veggie Legs]

Why does sentencing take so long? Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it very nearly immediate in the UK?

Not always, it can be several weeks. I think it tends to be longer for more serious cases.

 

[TheArtfulDodger]

I'm not sure what to think. His version of events seems unlikely, but equally I don't think it sounds like a premeditated thing. If it was premeditated it was certainly an innovative plan.

"I'll wait til she goes for a shit then shoot her on the bog. That'll teach her for using the last sheet of paper and not putting a fresh one out."

Premeditated doesn't necessarily mean he sat and plotted the whole thing out, it just means he knowingly took actions that would deliberately kill the person. Shooting a shotgun is certainly that. The reversal is more related to the fact that he meant to kill 'whoever' was behind the door, irrespective of who he thought it was. Of course we all know he is a lying murderer and although he will probably end up with a relatively light 7-8 year stretch, it's the conviction which means the most I think, justice got him in the end and I'm delighted.

 

[sl1k]

Why does sentencing take so long? Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it very nearly immediate in the UK?

Not always, it can be several weeks. I think it tends to be longer for more serious cases.

Usually gets adjourned for pre sentence report, 2-4 weeks for the average crown court case. As veggie said probs longer in more serious or complicated cases.

The fact he got done for anything other than murder in the first place was absurd. His story is proper crap.

 

[Gulliball]

When the details of this first came to light my first thought was that he had to be guilty of murder. Just because it is a burglar does not give you the right to fire 4 shots directly at them. The prosecution dredged up all their relationship spats and neighbours, and the defence argued the opposite, but ultimately he made no effort to discover what the dangers were and his first response was to pick up a gun and fire shots straight away. The prosecution proved that he knew a lot about guns, especially the special ammunition he had ordered that exploded on impact for maximum damage.

I never quite understood how after months and months of the trial he was found not guilty of murder when these points were all proven and the defence was that he never intended to kill Reeva. Today the appeals committee came out and said what was pretty obvious from the start, that shooting four bullets into a closed toilet will kill someone and he never knew he was in danger because he never attempted to find out.

Certainly in using three different defence arguments he came across as someone just looking to say anything that would get him off the murder charge. It was always going to cause problems having just one person give a verdict, and the whole case has exposed the flaws in that system. Given what he did, I don't think anyone would argue that he doesn't deserve more than one year in prison. Even if you accept his version of events that he didn't know it was her, the situation is that he heard a noise, never attempted to find out who made it, picked up a gun and shot to kill. 15 years minimum is a more reflective sentence.

 

[Pyeman]

Premeditated doesn't necessarily mean he sat and plotted the whole thing out, it just means he knowingly took actions that would deliberately kill the person. Shooting a shotgun is certainly that. The reversal is more related to the fact that he meant to kill 'whoever' was behind the door, irrespective of who he thought it was. Of course we all know he is a lying murderer and although he will probably end up with a relatively light 7-8 year stretch, it's the conviction which means the most I think, justice got him in the end and I'm delighted.

I've just seen on the news this evening that she wasn't even in a bathroom so to speak, she was in a small toilet cubicle. I thought she was in a bathroom and so when he shot the door, he could have thought the person might be anywhere in the room. But if she was in a small cubicle then its a different story.

 

[Pagnell]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-35034292

There can't be many examples of a convicted murderer being out on bail between conviction and sentencing, even if they are appealing. A strange system they have over there.

Plus, all this doesn't answer the biggest question. Where will he wear the tag?

 

[Dave-Vale]

One of the strangest cases of recent times.

No idea why he's been bailed.. He's going end up serving his sentence under house arrest.

 

[mowgli]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-35034292

There can't be many examples of a convicted murderer being out on bail between conviction and sentencing, even if they are appealing. A strange system they have over there.

Plus, all this doesn't answer the biggest question. Where will he wear the tag?

 

[Pagnell]

One of the strangest cases of recent times.

No idea why he's been bailed.. He's going end up serving his sentence under house arrest.

I really can't see that. If his appeal isn't successful (and all indications are that it won't be given that he's effectively appealing an appeal which was decided by the foremost judges in the country), there is no way he will serve a sentence of murder under house arrest, there would be an absolute uproar. However, I can certainly see him getting a light sentence as discretion by the judge is allowed. So, the talk of 15 years minimum for murder needs to be taken with a pinch of salt. Also, as I already mentioned, I believe the judge who fucked up the original conviction is due to decide the length of sentence. I wouldn't be surprised to see him get just 8-10 years and be out in less than 5.

 

[HertsWolf]

 

[mowgli]

 

[Pagnell]

So, after spending the last six months under house arrest, convicted murderer Oscar Pistorius is currently being sentenced. His defence team appear to be desperate to portray him as a broken man (rather than dead, unlike his victim), severely depressed and are attempting to get his sentence reduced as much as possible and served in hospital. Personally, and apologies if this sounds harsh, but I hope this doesn't work. He is convicted of murder, and he surely needs a jail term to reflect that.