Saturday 1st October 2022

BarrieOwl

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Whether its over or just under what LV says is pretty spot on, you'll have players on probably average wages 4 or 5 times ours so will expect to beat us and should be walking the league.

Its not a dig specifically at Sheffield Wednesday, there is some bonkers spending in the third tier (Ipswich spending £1 million on a left back for instance) but that's a football problem than one of any club.

Clubs who spend big money always seem to get defensive over it for some reason but the reason clubs will get promoted this season will almost certainly be down to spending more money. That's the food chain in football and the same in most leagues (bar Sal£ord of course!)
We can afford to spend more because we generate more income, it is that simple, I am not being overly defensive I just find it tiresome the constant jibes from fans who seem to know more about my clubs finances than our fans!
 

SVH

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If you can afford it why is it bonkers? Every club should spend with their means and Ipswich and others can.

Whether they spend it wisely is another conversation but they obviously generate the income to allow it.
 

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Whether its over or just under what LV says is pretty spot on, you'll have players on probably average wages 4 or 5 times ours so will expect to beat us and should be walking the league.

Its not a dig specifically at Sheffield Wednesday, there is some bonkers spending in the third tier (Ipswich spending £1 million on a left back for instance) but that's a football problem than one of any club.

Clubs who spend big money always seem to get defensive over it for some reason but the reason clubs will get promoted this season will almost certainly be down to spending more money. That's the food chain in football and the same in most leagues (bar Sal£ord of course!)
I agree with that.
For us, its probably more beneficial staying in L2 and challenging every season than struggling in L1 with no chance of success, especially being stuck at the Mem for the foreseeable.
Its shocking clubs like Sheff Weds and Ipswich find themselves mingling with the riff-raff, but the likes of Southampton, Leicester, Leeds, Norwich and Man City have done the same..
 

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If you can afford it why is it bonkers? Every club should spend with their means and Ipswich and others can.

Whether they spend it wisely is another conversation but they obviously generate the income to allow it.
He didn't suggest they weren't within their means he just said its bonkers money for this level which it is.

The disparity between Morecambe say and Sheffield Wednesday in wages for the same level is bonkers but that's football. You can say the same for Brentford and Man City for instance, Real Madrid and Eibar etc.

In the past League One was less affected by that kind of gulf but in recent seasons with the rise of the smaller clubs who are heavily financed its pushed some of the bigger giants down the pyramid. Hence you now get 5 or 6 so called giants down here.
 

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It's weird because i've always said you don't need money to get out of this level and thats been true, yet now its becoming vital because more is being spent on wages and transfer fees
 

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It's weird because i've always said you don't need money to get out of this level and thats been true, yet now its becoming vital because more is being spent on wages and transfer fees
It is, we've spent more money than we've spent since our Championship days and are not even close to being competitive at the top end... years ago you could but now its going to require a lot of developing and time in most cases bar the odd exception such as Wycombe for instance.
 

BRFC_Gas

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It is, we've spent more money than we've spent since our Championship days and are not even close to being competitive at the top end... years ago you could but now its going to require a lot of developing and time in most cases bar the odd exception such as Wycombe for instance.
You would think they didnt need to spend as much as many of them have a good level academy, decent sized stadiums and can attract a higher calibre of player.
Like you said 1 million for a LB in league one is insane.
 

thewwfc

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It is, we've spent more money than we've spent since our Championship days and are not even close to being competitive at the top end... years ago you could but now its going to require a lot of developing and time in most cases bar the odd exception such as Wycombe for instance.
even in our case we've got something of a sugar daddy in place, which we didn't always have. We used to be bottom end in terms of our wage budget, but I'd imagine we're mid-table now. We've got a few players (the likes of Vokes and McCleary) who are used to Championship wages so it's not like we can pretend we've got no money any more.

Except our lone season in the Championship, whereby I imagine us and Rotherham were bottom of the wages table by a mile.
 

BarrieOwl

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You would think they didnt need to spend as much as many of them have a good level academy, decent sized stadiums and can attract a higher calibre of player.
Like you said 1 million for a LB in league one is insane.
Our academy is shite
 

BarrieOwl

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It's probably better than a lot of teams in league one. We only got our own training ground a few years ago after years of renting one
Due to our proximity to several PL clubs we don't get the pick of the players for the academy and when clubs like Brentford are snapping up any talent we do have it can be annoying.

Bailey Cadamateri is our new hope though
 

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Due to our proximity to several PL clubs we don't get the pick of the players for the academy and when clubs like Brentford are snapping up any talent we do have it can be annoying.

Bailey Cadamateri is our new hope though
we have that problem with Brentford too, and it's even worse as they're only just down the road from us.
 

BarrieOwl

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Oh no. Another player to make me feel my age. I remember when his dad burst onto the scene as an exciting nipper at Everton. I'm so old. I need to go and lie down.:ohm:
I remember his dad scoring at Hillsborough for Everton
 

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Our academy is shite
Our academy has produced one member of our first team squad this season, a lad named Harvey Bunker and he looks half-decent...I have a horrible feeling that he will be snapped up by a much larger team and disappear into their U-23s never to be seen again.
 

valefan16

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Our academy has produced one member of our first team squad this season, a lad named Harvey Bunker and he looks half-decent...I have a horrible feeling that he will be snapped up by a much larger team and disappear into their U-23s never to be seen again.
That’s the issue isn’t it. We had a lad who came through our acedemy make his Championship debut for Reading recently. They’d snapped him up before we even knew about him as fans.

That said Tommy McDermott looks like he could do well for us, now Gibbons has gone we’ve only got Smith left from the academy.
 

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Daft amounts? Are you privy to our wages or just assuming as you do quite often?
You're a touchy bugger you are. Whichever way you spin it, your wages will be daft for this level. That's not a slight on Wednesday in particular..it's the reality of football these days that it doesn't come down to ability and a good manager anymore but simply who has got the biggest budget. Teams like Derby or Nottingham Forest back in the late 70s will never happen again unless things change.

Some of the big clubs nowadays might not always have had the fan base they do now, but due to relative success over a sustained period of time, they have attracted more fans. It's like that lot down the road from us...they have historically had a more successful history than us over a sustained period of time, so most people growing up in Stoke over the 60s, 70s and 80s would have gone on to support stoke as they were in the top division and then it continues in their family. So hence now they draw in bigger crowds. I believe if vale spent the next 50 years in the premier league/championship, and stoke were in league 2, then vale would become the bigger and better supported club. Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever get that opportunity unless we get taken over by a Saudi sultan.

To me, football should be made a level playing field. Do a player draft with a wage cap. The bigger teams would still probably attract the best players as they would want to play in front of more fans in bigger stadiums but at the very least it would make football more about the skills of the coaches and less about how much money the owner has. It would be so much more exciting than seeing Man City, Liverpool at the top of the premier league year after year. I could get man city to win the league.
 

BarrieOwl

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You're a touchy bugger you are. Whichever way you spin it, your wages will be daft for this level. That's not a slight on Wednesday in particular..it's the reality of football these days that it doesn't come down to ability and a good manager anymore but simply who has got the biggest budget. Teams like Derby or Nottingham Forest back in the late 70s will never happen again unless things change.

Some of the big clubs nowadays might not always have had the fan base they do now, but due to relative success over a sustained period of time, they have attracted more fans. It's like that lot down the road from us...they have historically had a more successful history than us over a sustained period of time, so most people growing up in Stoke over the 60s, 70s and 80s would have gone on to support stoke as they were in the top division and then it continues in their family. So hence now they draw in bigger crowds. I believe if vale spent the next 50 years in the premier league/championship, and stoke were in league 2, then vale would become the bigger and better supported club. Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever get that opportunity unless we get taken over by a Saudi sultan.

To me, football should be made a level playing field. Do a player draft with a wage cap. The bigger teams would still probably attract the best players as they would want to play in front of more fans in bigger stadiums but at the very least it would make football more about the skills of the coaches and less about how much money the owner has. It would be so much more exciting than seeing Man City, Liverpool at the top of the premier league year after year. I could get man city to win the league.

If you want drafts and salary caps I suggest you fuck off and watch other sports, mainly Yank ones.
 

masi51

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I would expect two of the biggest earning stars in this league are at Bolton.....I can certainly say we are not paying those salaries in full.
This is where teams are at a disadvantage in this league. Fortunately we have the infrastructure and play the right way to attract two of the best loan deals in the EFL

I dont see more than 2/3 teams being able to attract such players
 

kieran_vale

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To me, football should be made a level playing field. Do a player draft with a wage cap. The bigger teams would still probably attract the best players as they would want to play in front of more fans in bigger stadiums but at the very least it would make football more about the skills of the coaches and less about how much money the owner has. It would be so much more exciting than seeing Man City, Liverpool at the top of the premier league year after year. I could get man city to win the league.

I don’t think there is any way that system would work. Who would be developing these players that enter the draft and what would be the incentive for it given we don’t really have a college system like they have in America?

As for Saturday we’ll more than likely lose but who knows if they come into the game ill-prepared or just assuming they’ll only have to turn up then anything’s possible. On a personal note for the sole reason that club are responsible for that fucking England band I hope their trip is thoroughly miserable (and not just because it’s in Burslem before any comedian thinks about saying it).
 

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If you want drafts and salary caps I suggest you fuck off and watch other sports, mainly Yank ones.
See what I mean about being touchy? For the record I fucking despise American sport. Horrendous.

Maybe a draft wouldn't work, but there has to be some achievable pathway for even those clubs in the national league to get to the very top. Otherwise we're stuck with this closed shop at the top of the premier league for evermore. Let's face it, if you and say Bolton got 2 promotions on the bounce, you'd be constantly playing the battle for the top of the bottom 4 in the premier league. And eventually you'd come back down. Being a Norwich fan must be purgatory. The Premier league bores me to tears. But can you imagine if an Accrington got there, or a Barrow, just to mix it up a bit?

It just feels like a very uncompetitive sport that should be played on a level playing field but it isn't.
 

Laker

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See what I mean about being touchy? For the record I fucking despise American sport. Horrendous.

Maybe a draft wouldn't work, but there has to be some achievable pathway for even those clubs in the national league to get to the very top. Otherwise we're stuck with this closed shop at the top of the premier league for evermore. Let's face it, if you and say Bolton got 2 promotions on the bounce, you'd be constantly playing the battle for the top of the bottom 4 in the premier league. And eventually you'd come back down. Being a Norwich fan must be purgatory. The Premier league bores me to tears. But can you imagine if an Accrington got there, or a Barrow, just to mix it up a bit?

It just feels like a very uncompetitive sport that should be played on a level playing field but it isn't.
It’s an unfair game but that’s not restricted to just football. If you’ve not seen it then I recommend watching Moneyball. It’s about Baseball but covers finances and “beating the house” in sport.
 

valefan16

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See what I mean about being touchy? For the record I fucking despise American sport. Horrendous.

Maybe a draft wouldn't work, but there has to be some achievable pathway for even those clubs in the national league to get to the very top. Otherwise we're stuck with this closed shop at the top of the premier league for evermore. Let's face it, if you and say Bolton got 2 promotions on the bounce, you'd be constantly playing the battle for the top of the bottom 4 in the premier league. And eventually you'd come back down. Being a Norwich fan must be purgatory. The Premier league bores me to tears. But can you imagine if an Accrington got there, or a Barrow, just to mix it up a bit?

It just feels like a very uncompetitive sport that should be played on a level playing field but it isn't.
I don’t like the idea of a draft at all but certainly league one and two should have a realistic salary cap.

The issue now is these big clubs spending big is fine as they can afford it but you’ll get smaller clubs getting into trouble paying big wages to try and compete that they can’t afford and of course players demanding more money in league one because X club pays X player 15k a week.

When we came up before and obviously down to this level from above in 2000 you always felt we could have a go but the money in it now is completely different to say 4-5 years ago.

Anyone getting five figure a week salaries in league one is ridiculous regardless of who is paying it.
 

Boletus Edulis

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Pretty sure we have at least four who have played this year in the league who have come from the academy, of which two will move higher and make us money:Cooper and Randell. we have two more out on loan in league two in Law and Jephcott. I also think at least three of the current under 18s have been on the bench in the league this season. several others have been in the pizza cup teams, in fact I am pretty sure we recently had 7 players currently in or have been in the under 18s finish a pizza cup game. two of the three goals against Swindon last week were scored by 17 year olds. Freddie Issaca turned out for us at 15 years and 135 days, and could not travel to Ipswich last year with the first team because he his school insisted he sit a mock. The club has deliberately targeted the academy, and slowly it is paying off. probably not as good as Exeter’s yet, but we are getting there.
 

masi51

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I don’t like the idea of a draft at all but certainly league one and two should have a realistic salary cap.

The issue now is these big clubs spending big is fine as they can afford it but you’ll get smaller clubs getting into trouble paying big wages to try and compete that they can’t afford and of course players demanding more money in league one because X club pays X player 15k a week.

When we came up before and obviously down to this level from above in 2000 you always felt we could have a go but the money in it now is completely different to say 4-5 years ago.

Anyone getting five figure a week salaries in league one is ridiculous regardless of who is paying it.
Out of interest and i am sure there are other high profile players on loan, but how much do you think James Trafford will be on at Manchester City after signing a new six year contract in the summer and who iis currently the England u21 Goalkeeper. I would be amazed ifhe is not the highest paid player to ever play in league one.
We simply could not pay his wages
 

UppaTowen_ITFC

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You would think they didnt need to spend as much as many of them have a good level academy, decent sized stadiums and can attract a higher calibre of player.
Like you said 1 million for a LB in league one is insane.
It’s insane in your view but he’s young and we’ve clearly bought him with a view that he’s going to be better value in a couple of years time where he’d be worth a lot more.

In recent years we’ve sold Mings and Cresswell at left back for a combined 14m.
 

BarrieOwl

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See what I mean about being touchy? For the record I fucking despise American sport. Horrendous.

Maybe a draft wouldn't work, but there has to be some achievable pathway for even those clubs in the national league to get to the very top. Otherwise we're stuck with this closed shop at the top of the premier league for evermore. Let's face it, if you and say Bolton got 2 promotions on the bounce, you'd be constantly playing the battle for the top of the bottom 4 in the premier league. And eventually you'd come back down. Being a Norwich fan must be purgatory. The Premier league bores me to tears. But can you imagine if an Accrington got there, or a Barrow, just to mix it up a bit?

It just feels like a very uncompetitive sport that should be played on a level playing field but it isn't.
I'm not touchy I just don't enjoy reading your posts they appear full of jealousy of other clubs and a sense of self importance, perhaps a side effect of living in Leeds.
 
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UppaTowen_ITFC

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I don’t like the idea of a draft at all but certainly league one and two should have a realistic salary cap.

The issue now is these big clubs spending big is fine as they can afford it but you’ll get smaller clubs getting into trouble paying big wages to try and compete that they can’t afford and of course players demanding more money in league one because X club pays X player 15k a week.

When we came up before and obviously down to this level from above in 2000 you always felt we could have a go but the money in it now is completely different to say 4-5 years ago.

Anyone getting five figure a week salaries in league one is ridiculous regardless of who is paying it.
Have to admit I hate the idea of a salary cap. Us, Wednesday and derby are all getting 23k+ a week. Burton, Accrington etc get 10% of that.

If a salary cap is introduced, it is going to only affect the bigger clubs. Which is not at all fair. It takes these clubs half a season to get the same ticket revenue as we get in one game, and we’re punished for that? I’m not sure how that logically is fair.
 
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