The General England Euro 2016 Thread

[JimJams]

(systems don't win you football matches, the best players do). .

I'd love Roy to explain this theory to the likes of Greece, Denmark or more recently the likes of Leicester and even Atletico. Such an idiotic thing to say.

 

[Benji]

I’ve heard rumours of sinister sponsorship reasons meaning that certain players have to be in the squad/team and to be honest sometimes you wonder if there is something to it.

Brazil were busted doing this a few years ago if I remember rightly. There's no reason to imagine that was the first and only case of it. England (and others) hardly give you much reason to doubt it.

 

[Stevencc]

Strong joke, Lib.

 

[Stevencc]

Lib it's not fair to single me out when numerous others have worked it out made the same joke.

 

[JaseTheVillain]

You are nominated as the new Ian, Ste.

 

[IanH]

I've just been tipped off on the offical starting lineup for Russia match, but keeping it to Team Gullit chat just now. Sorry

 

[mistermagic]

Going on a previous point, Hodgson is still in the England because nobody else is available.

I can see what people are saying re the diamond 442 (or 4312) not being great for most of the players. I also agree that Alli or Wilshere would be better in the top of the diamond role than Rooney but let's face it, Woy is a yes man and will never drop him if he's fit. Never.

I just hope the Russia game is more entertaining than what we witnessed last night. That was shocking.

 

[Vale on Trent]

The width in the team has to come from somewhere, and with a midfield diamond it has to come from the strikers. All this stuff about width coming from the full backs is bollocks - obviously they're going to get forward effectively, but they can't cover the whole flank alone.

Even if you decide the team doesn't need to play with any width, you still need to defend against the opposing full backs. That means either Kane and Vardy splitting wide, or the central midfielders (Alli and Wilshere, or whoever) moving wider and Rooney dropping back. I don't find either of those desirable.

The midfield diamond still feels to me like an attempt to shoehorn the best eleven players in, and that's not the way to create the best team.

Hooray, someone finally speaking sense regarding the diamond formation.

You can't play a diamond without the two forwards being dragged out wide.

 

[Ciderhead]

Hooray, someone finally speaking sense regarding the diamond formation.

You can't play a diamond without the two forwards being dragged out wide.

Liverpool managed it all right, back when they had the SaSaS. You just need 2 engine rooms in those central roles to get about and cover the space, like Milner or Henderson. Lallana, Wilshere (or Drinkwater argh) could also potentially fill those roles

 

[JaseTheVillain]

SaSaS?? Suarez and Sturridge and.... Steve?

 

[Ciderhead]

Sterling. Back when he was the next big thing

 

[SamScfc]

Because you should be picking players on recent form, not on reputation, or what they did in qualifying and a couple of friendlies over a fucking year ago. He hasn't completed 90 minutes since something stupid like November 2014, it's ridiculous that people think the bloke should make the squad after a season like he's just had.

Why we keep taking crocked players to tournaments is beyond me, we did it with Rooney at the last world cup, and this time we're doing it with Wilshere and Henderson ffs. Players who are in form (Drinkwater for example....) should be going over players with a bit of a reputation. However, once again, we have a manager who doesn't have the bollocks to drop the players with a reputation over the players who are actually in form at the moment.

Yes, Wilshere had a lot of man of the matches in his last few England appearances, but these were over a year ago, I could understand it if he had been putting those man of the match performances in during the last season, but he hasn't. He's been sat on the treatment table all season, and does not deserve to be playing in an international tournament on the basis of how he played the season before last for England (because he wasn't even that great for Arsenal during that season).

He's our best player. Or one of.

If Ronaldo was injured all season, Portugal would still take him, and no I'm not comparing Wilshere and Ronaldo.

 

[Jarv]

One of the 2 forwards in a diamond being dragged out wide one side or the other is fine as it's not both of them at the same time and the tip of the diamond can fill in the space in the middle.

Personally i think 4-3-3 is our best option or 4-2-3-1.

Drinkwater or Henderson, I'd have probably taken Drinkwater he's had the season of his life. I don't think there is muuch at all between him and Henderson and Drinkwater is fit and in form.

Wilshere is one of our best players if he's fit but we shouldn't be taking players who are barely fit. we have 3 players that are likely to miss at least 1 game with an injury probably more in Henderson, Sturridge and Wilshere. None of them should be going, let alone 2 in the central midfield places. Sturridge isn't as big of an issue as he's 4th/5th choice anyway i suppose

Take a chance on 1 maybe but not 3

 

[Max]

For those who are saying Hodgson 'is a shit manager', was there something about the 10 wins out of 10 in qualifying that you thought needed improving upon?

The England team has lost two out of its last 21 games (Spain and the Netherlands). We've beaten Portugal, Germany and France in that time, who have previously all been known to embarrass us on the world stage.

We've also recently racked up wins despite playing admittedly an unusual system. But then again people always complain when managers use friendlies to play what they know to be their best XI (thus not learn anything and waste a game we could've tried out some new ideas). Roy Hodgson tries out some new combinations of players and ideas, wins football matches, but still can't please people?

Yes, I know, a lot of you like Drinkwater and would like to have him included. But other than that specific grievance, most people seem to agree with 20/21 of the 23 player selection, but just want to show what they'd be doing if this were Football Manager and they were managing England.

 

[Ciderhead]

I think Hodgson gets a lot of unfair stick. He's branded this defensive, boring coach who always picks his favourites but I don't think we've had anyone more tactically flexible, who gives more young, in form players a chance, in my lifetime

 

[Max]

I think Hodgson gets a lot of unfair stick. He's branded this defensive, boring coach who always picks his favourites but I don't think we've had anyone more tactically flexible, who gives more young, in form players a chance, in my lifetime

I don't know how old you are, but yeah, that.

Fabio Capello got a lot of unfair stick as well. People who don't like Hodgson can rarely offer a better manager as an alternative.

 

[smat]

Wilshere is one of our best players if he's fit but we shouldn't be taking players who are barely fit. we have 3 players that are likely to miss at least 1 game with an injury probably more in Henderson, Sturridge and Wilshere. None of them should be going

Ridiculous. Take your best players. There are 23 in the squad, we've got plenty of cover in case of injury.

 

[Storzy]

Henderson, Drinkwater, Delph, Noble....

Who cares? All four are pretty muchwater carriers and it's depressing that they're basically the typical English midfielder. I really don't think picking one of those over the others (excluding Delph's injury) is going to make any difference to our chances at the Euro's. Also Wilshere has to go and he has to start, the midfield without him is terrible and we won't have anyone to link defence to the attack.

 

[Viv Aldi]

Henderson, Drinkwater,Delph, Noble....

Who cares? All four are pretty muchwater carriers and it's depressing that they're basically the typical English midfielder. I really don't think picking one of those over the others (excluding Delph's injury) is going to make any difference to our chances at the Euro's. Also Wilshere has to go and he has to start, the midfield without him is terrible and we won't have anyone to link defence to the attack.

Drinkwater has shown he can pick apart defences with a killer ball.

 

[Storzy]

Doing it was once or twice isn't enough. You can point to all those players including Noble doing it occasionally.

None of them are creative nor can the be relied upon to offer that. ANYTHING they offer in the final third is to be considered a bonus.

I can point to Coquelin playing some killer passes, but he's still a water carrier for Arsenal and you play him alongside creative players.

 

[Viv Aldi]

Doing it was once or twice isn't enough. You can point to all those players including Noble doing it occasionally.

None of them are creative nor can the be relied upon to offer that. ANYTHING they offer in the final third is to be considered a bonus.

I can point to Coquelin playing some killer passes, but he's still a water carrier for Arsenal and you play him alongside creative players.

He was a key player in a midfield that won the Premier League. He easily deserved a place in the squad, arguably should be starting

 

[Storzy]

I think you're overstating how key he was. Had they swapped him with Mark Noble, I'd argue they'd still have won the league and West Ham would still be in 7th.

 

[JimJams]

Only to the degree that people overstate how key Kante was. When Drinkwater was out, King came in and we got results. When Kante was out, King came in and we got results. Kantes world class, Drinkwater is a water(!) carrier.

 

[Gashead]

Only to the degree that people overstate how key Kante was. When Drinkwater was out, King came in and we got results. When Kante was out, King came in and we got results. Kantes world class, Drinkwater is a water(!) carrier.

I think you're missing the common factor of all this, which is that Andy King is going to dominate the Euros.

 

[Storzy]

Only to the degree that people overstate how key Kante was. When Drinkwater was out, King came in and we got results. When Kante was out, King came in and we got results. Kantes world class, Drinkwater is a water(!) carrier.

How many games did Kante miss?

 

[JimJams]

Only a handful. Well the opening 4 of 5 we played with him on the bench, King and Drinkwater started and Kante came in for the forwards and tended to play on the wing at the end of games. Later in the season he had an injury for a whole match, yeah a whole 1. I think he'd only started 1 or 2 games before you beat us.

 

[mistermagic]

You go chimp and tell us again how good Drinkwater is.

Kanté is ok I guess.

 

[JimJams]

He's good. Kante is better. The gulf between the two is nowhere near how some people are portraying it.

 

[Storzy]

Only a handful. Well the opening 4 of 5 we played with him on the bench, King and Drinkwater started and Kante came in for the forwards and tended to play on the wing at the end of games. Later in the season he had an injury for a whole match, yeah a whole 1. I think he'd only started 1 or 2 games before you beat us.

Just checked and he played 37 out of 38 games. 4 being sub appearances.

I don't think I'm convinced on Drinkwater being a key player for Leciester nor his importance in starting for England. Certainly not enough to excited over him not playing and some other very similar player starting instead.

 

[mistermagic]

You can say the same of Simpson and Fuchs. Just a cohesive team with decent players which is something nobody else had.