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The proper relegation thread.

Shrimper92

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You should see their latest offering, like deciphering the da vinci code.

Also looking like null and void, wank away lads!

I'm seeing the opposite.

The first vote is to decide their own leagues which will likely pass.

NS/NN likely void.

NL likely continue. 8-1-1 in favour at moment
 

Chief Rocka

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I'm seeing the opposite.

The first vote is to decide their own leagues which will likely pass.

NS/NN likely void.

NL likely continue. 8-1-1 in favour at moment

No, the first resolution won't pass, it needs 75% majority, assuming the North and South vote against which accounts for 8 votes, each league having 4 votes each, the National League would need all 23 teams to vote for in order to pass, I don't see it, you only need one club currently in a mess to say fuck it and put a spanner in the works and it all falls down.

It’s a fucking mess basically.
 
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pontoonlew

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No, the first resolution won't pass, it needs 75% majority, assuming the North and South vote against which accounts for 8 votes, each league having 4 votes each, the National League would need all 23 teams to vote for in order to pass, I don't see it, you only need one club currently in a mess to say fuck it and put a spanner in the works and it all falls down.

It’s a fucking mess basically.
That’s not how I read it.

There are 31 votes available, 8 go to the bottom 2 leagues and 23 to the top. 8 votes will almost certainly go for void, meaning 16 in NL would need to vote null & void. Still unlikely but then once you consider the next options for individual leagues stand at 50%, it seems more likely for a null & void.
 

Railway Blue

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the thought of being in the conference with this happening is enough to make me shudder.

They couldn’t organise a piss up at a brewery.
They organised it very well to suit their own clubs.
 

GEORGE

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5 years of rich football league history for us.
Actually it might do Southend good in the long run to have a couple years in the Conference. But Grimsby need to stay up. I remember seeing the faces of their fans when we beat them at Wembley -- Not a pretty sight. At least Hurst is trying to get you out of trouble and for whats its worth i think Grimsby will stay up "Just".
 

jacobncfc

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That’s not how I read it.

There are 31 votes available, 8 go to the bottom 2 leagues and 23 to the top. 8 votes will almost certainly go for void, meaning 16 in NL would need to vote null & void. Still unlikely but then once you consider the next options for individual leagues stand at 50%, it seems more likely for a null & void.

Hi all, how are we doing up here? Sad to report we’ve had to become experts on the constitution of the National League.

I think this is a slight misreading of what resolution one is trying to do. It’s just allowing the two levels to uncouple from each other.

If we assume a majority in both step two leagues for null and void (which is unclear in itself, particularly in the south) and a majority at step one for continuing (fairly likely, I think), it’s in the interest of clubs at both levels to pass it. The potential rebels are, weirdly, the clubs at step two who are desperate to continue (Gloucester, York, Dorking et al) and those at step one who are desperate to null and void (currently a one club band, Dover, but likely more privately). They may both think that their best chance of getting what they want is to bind the vote together.

If you want a sense of which way it will go, look out for anything public from Halifax, Eastleigh, Bromley, Aldershot, Yeovil, Dagenham and Woking. They’re what I’d class as the ‘swing clubs’, whose direction in the vote isn’t obvious.

If there’s 16 National League clubs that want to continue, they can’t lose the vote, no matter what happens with the different resolutions. You’ve already got Hartlepool, Sutton, Notts, Maidenhead, Altrincham, Solihull, Chesterfield and Boreham Wood who have indicated this publicly. Wrexham’s abstention effectively counts as a vote for because of the wording of the resolutions. I think you can confidently add Torquay and Stockport. So if five of the others come out in favour, that’s the way it’s heading.

In general, I think the maths makes it very difficult to see null and void at step one, but if it’s quite close then that could get messy in itself.
 

pontoonlew

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Hi all, how are we doing up here? Sad to report we’ve had to become experts on the constitution of the National League.

I think this is a slight misreading of what resolution one is trying to do. It’s just allowing the two levels to uncouple from each other.

If we assume a majority in both step two leagues for null and void (which is unclear in itself, particularly in the south) and a majority at step one for continuing (fairly likely, I think), it’s in the interest of clubs at both levels to pass it. The potential rebels are, weirdly, the clubs at step two who are desperate to continue (Gloucester, York, Dorking et al) and those at step one who are desperate to null and void (currently a one club band, Dover, but likely more privately). They may both think that their best chance of getting what they want is to bind the vote together.

If you want a sense of which way it will go, look out for anything public from Halifax, Eastleigh, Bromley, Aldershot, Yeovil, Dagenham and Woking. They’re what I’d class as the ‘swing clubs’, whose direction in the vote isn’t obvious.

If there’s 16 National League clubs that want to continue, they can’t lose the vote, no matter what happens with the different resolutions. You’ve already got Hartlepool, Sutton, Notts, Maidenhead, Altrincham, Solihull, Chesterfield and Boreham Wood who have indicated this publicly. Wrexham’s abstention effectively counts as a vote for because of the wording of the resolutions. I think you can confidently add Torquay and Stockport. So if five of the others come out in favour, that’s the way it’s heading.

In general, I think the maths makes it very difficult to see null and void at step one, but if it’s quite close then that could get messy in itself.
There’s a few potential minefields that’ll make things messy by the looks of it, I’ve accepted that we’re not going to get our get out of jail free card though.

One thing is for absolute certain, one or two clubs blind stupidity in continuing will almost certainly send them bust. It’s a terrible proposition being part of it next season but the only solace I take is that it’s not likely to be the competitive league it once was.
 

Shrimper92

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Stevenage playing Exeter tonight. If they win we're all but doomed. We'd be 8 points (9 with GD) behind. Barrow the only other team we could really hope to catch. Big month coming up. Will be a lot clearer after. 14 games left after.
 

AdamStag

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Stevenage playing Exeter tonight. If they win we're all but doomed. We'd be 8 points (9 with GD) behind. Barrow the only other team we could really hope to catch. Big month coming up. Will be a lot clearer after. 14 games left after.

you’d gone on a little run and right in there, what’s happened!
 

jacobncfc

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There’s a few potential minefields that’ll make things messy by the looks of it, I’ve accepted that we’re not going to get our get out of jail free card though.

One thing is for absolute certain, one or two clubs blind stupidity in continuing will almost certainly send them bust. It’s a terrible proposition being part of it next season but the only solace I take is that it’s not likely to be the competitive league it once was.

I doubt it - the baffling way that grant funding was allocated earlier in the season meant that the burden of the cost of playing fell on the better supported clubs, who are more likely to be able to cope with it. Even the loans that are being offered now are on extremely generous terms.

I actually used to have a job that meant I watched loads of National League around the time you were last down here. It’s a different league to then - I think the teams near the top tend not to be as strong (we nearly came straight back up despite signing our entire team in the first month of the season), but the ones at the bottom are miles stronger. Genuinely think the Chorley team that got pummelled last season would’ve been mid-table in those days.
 

Luke Imp

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Actually it might do Southend good in the long run to have a couple years in the Conference. But Grimsby need to stay up. I remember seeing the faces of their fans when we beat them at Wembley -- Not a pretty sight. At least Hurst is trying to get you out of trouble and for whats its worth i think Grimsby will stay up "Just".
Southend are the sort of Club who will end up doing a York/Chesterfield/Torquay and slip into the regionals I think.
 

Son of Cod

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Southend are the sort of Club who will end up doing a York/Chesterfield/Torquay and slip into the regionals I think.
Stockport not Chesterfield, you mean? I really don't get how this happens to ex-league clubs. You have to be proper shit for that to happen. Even when we had Neil Woods in charge and a grand total of one decent player in our squad we still finished top half and this was a time when the top 5 were strong too (Crawley, Wimbledon, Luton, Wrexham and Fleetwood).
 

Luke Imp

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Yeah sorry, Stockport. I was thinking of Chesterfield's near miss last season.
 

Jerry

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Stockport not Chesterfield, you mean? I really don't get how this happens to ex-league clubs. You have to be proper shit for that to happen. Even when we had Neil Woods in charge and a grand total of one decent player in our squad we still finished top half and this was a time when the top 5 were strong too (Crawley, Wimbledon, Luton, Wrexham and Fleetwood).
Simple explanation, we were proper shit.

But in fairness Jacob is right, the league as a whole is a lot stronger than when we were down here the first time, even if the standard of the top few is lower.
 

BlackHaddock

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Southend are very much like Grimsby and Barnsley: Wait for it!

No newspaper can publish a report with a headline that starts with 'Southend win at Where ever'. It's always been 'Where ever loses to Southend'. They just can't use Southend, Grimsby or Barnsley at the front of an article. Grips my shit. The media do not want those three teams winning games and they'll do anything to belittle them.
 

Vanni

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Simple explanation, we were proper shit.

But in fairness Jacob is right, the league as a whole is a lot stronger than when we were down here the first time, even if the standard of the top few is lower.

It was back in 2009 wasn't it, when you Gulls beat us in the play off final. I still haven't recovered from that defeat :lol: You see, most U's fans were optimistic of beating Exeter in 2008 but not me, while it was the other way round for the 2009 final as I was pretty confident while most U's fans weren't. What can I say, I was wrong!

But I digress. I think you're doing your promotion winning side a disservice here because IMO the 2008/9 season was when it all started to get really serious down there. Those seasons between 2009 and 2015 were the NL's strongest years, in terms of good sides vying for promotion. There were years when tbf we did have a reasonably decent side and yet we just couldn't compete with the top dogs.

Good luck for the future, and I sincerely hope your season isn't null and voided seeing you Gulls are having such a good year.
 

Bottega Don

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Southend are very much like Grimsby and Barnsley: Wait for it!

No newspaper can publish a report with a headline that starts with 'Southend win at Where ever'. It's always been 'Where ever loses to Southend'. They just can't use Southend, Grimsby or Barnsley at the front of an article. Grips my shit. The media do not want those three teams winning games and they'll do anything to belittle them.
I can't imagine many newspapers are writing headlines about Grimsby games
 

Bottega Don

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Obviously not aware of a publication by the name of the Grimsby Telegraph?
Are they writing negative articles about Grimsby wins?

Not a lot of data to go off to be fair
 

Robshep

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You want to try getting a mention in a newspaper that has Liverpool to drool over and Everton as well. We are usually about 6 pages back at least in the sports part of the Liverpool Echo
Southend are very much like Grimsby and Barnsley: Wait for it!

No newspaper can publish a report with a headline that starts with 'Southend win at Where ever'. It's always been 'Where ever loses to Southend'. They just can't use Southend, Grimsby or Barnsley at the front of an article. Grips my shit. The media do not want those three teams winning games and they'll do anything to belittle them.
 

Son of Cod

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Are they writing negative articles about Grimsby wins?

Not a lot of data to go off to be fair
Must have missed the bit of your post that stipulated the spin of these hypothetical articles.

Plenty of data to go off here too...
...would be a load more if you'd have managed to keep up with us a bit better,
 

Bottega Don

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Must have missed the bit of your post that stipulated the spin of these hypothetical articles.

Plenty of data to go off here too...
...would be a load more if you'd have managed to keep up with us a bit better,
Well I was responding to a post that suggested Grimsby get negative articles written about them so it was implied.

You can hang onto those wins when you're back in the Conference
 

Jerry

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I think you're doing your promotion winning side a disservice here because IMO the 2008/9 season was when it all started to get really serious down there. Those seasons between 2009 and 2015 were the NL's strongest years, in terms of good sides vying for promotion. There were years when tbf we did have a reasonably decent side and yet we just couldn't compete with the top dogs.

Well yeah that was kind of my point, the top teams back then were stronger than they are now, the team we had under Buckle would absolutely walk this league now, but the bottom half of the league is a lot stronger. You don't get pub teams like Droylsden anymore. There are very few part time teams now and those that are (Woking, Wealdstone, Alty) are decent sides with a relatively decent fanbase.
 

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